Osama Bin Laden is DEAD!

[Monkey]

Well this is a very valid statement. I mean i want the picture so I can see that this man suffered before he died, but like always it doesn't accomplish anything, just like war. I know he was just another pawn in a worthless conflict to benefit the rich, just like every soldier that died.


Think about it, if someone raped and tortured your sister and you know who did it, would you kill their whole family trying to get to him, then after exhausting all of your resources and losing several more of your friends in the fight, you finally kill him. Was it worth it? I mean you started out being pissed because you lost someone who's life was important to you, but in the process of getting revenge you lost a thousands more friends and are now bankrupt, plus everyone thinks your a sociopathic killer now. Was it worth it? Does it change anything in the end? There was a net loss, and that is our problem, we are too reactionary and it always results in a net loss because we are the ones with something to lose. Some deranged muslim is just one man, and the worst that could happen to him is death (something which he believes will result in a reward from god anyways), so how do you even win against someone like that?

The answer is the same as it is for muslims and deranged religious types anyways, you have to just laugh at them and ignore their actions. Like a child who is breaking things to get attention, the worst punishment they can receive is to just be ignored and not get the attention they desire.


Edit: I still want the pic though. Then I want to start a nonprofit org who uses their funds to buy out builboards all over muslims countries that consist of nothing but a high res picture of his bloodgeoned body. The words on the bottom read "He's dead now, lets all take a moment to celebrate the fact that we are human and that no one wants to end up like the man in this picture. He looks this way because he chose the route of violence, let's all choose a different path lest we end up creating more images like this."

The idealology behind them attacking us was to attack our "Western" way of life and our freedoms.

I disagree with the sister raping analogy based on motive.....but that is a moot point, I wouldn't invade two countries for revenge as I am not vengeful by nature. I was angry as anybody on September 11 but strangely, I wasn't screaming for Osama Bin Laden's blood.

I am still angry that we had the intelligence to stop this but the government couldn't get its head out of its ass to realize this.

I am angry we went to Iraq after this happened because.......well I still don't know why......I don't think anyone does, really.

But most of all, I am angry that every day since these attacks we have seen our freedoms being taken away to "prevent terrorism".

The only way to beat these fundamental extremists is to be a free country. Never forget......but move on and continue living the way that pisses them off.

I am sure every time the tsa fondles someone's balls, a law restricting our individual rights is passed and the power of this country shifts from the many as a democracy to the few as a racist dictatorship they cheer....

The military should be here, defending our country and special ops should have been given this task in the first place......

Obama did this now because he just allowed combat pay (the trrops in danger are being called peacekeeping force and no longer qualify. **** him. He sends our best patriots over to get shot at in countries we shouldn't have gone to in the first place like we did and then cuts their pay for being there.

I don't normally get political when it comes to the internet but this is one point we all should have our voices heard on.

[bipolarbear1968]

Obama Bin Lyin'?

[internope]

Obama did this now because he just allowed combat pay (the trrops in danger are being called peacekeeping force and no longer qualify. **** him. He sends our best patriots over to get shot at in countries we shouldn't have gone to in the first place like we did and then cuts their pay for being there.

I can't find any evidence to support this claim. Citation?

I do see that a Democratic congressman from CA introduced a bill to increase the combat pay from current levels for troops in Afghanistan:

http://www.nationalguard.com/forums/...ise-Combat-Pay

A few months ago there was a rumor being spread regarding combat pay for troops that are still in Iraq, but it has been thoroughly debunked:

http://www.stripes.com/blogs/stripes...-pays-1.115952

http://www.stripes.com/blogs/the-rum...ept-1-1.105256

http://www.snopes.com/politics/military/payfreeze.asp

[Frosted]

Monkey - just to say that soldiers join up for action. They don't necessarily care where it is - they just love it, so don't feel sorry for the troops. Support them, but don't think the government have done them a disservice. Soldiers that join in peacetime usually eventually leave disappointed.

....and about special ops. Most troops today don't want to join special ops because they're already doing that job. It's got to the point where an infantrymans role and a special ops role is basically doing the same thing.

[Monkey]

I can't find any evidence to support this claim. Citation?

I do see that a Democratic congressman from CA introduced a bill to increase the combat pay from current levels for troops in Afghanistan:

http://www.nationalguard.com/forums/...ise-Combat-Pay

A few months ago there was a rumor being spread regarding combat pay for troops that are still in Iraq, but it has been thoroughly debunked:

http://www.stripes.com/blogs/stripes...-pays-1.115952

http://www.stripes.com/blogs/the-rum...ept-1-1.105256

http://www.snopes.com/politics/military/payfreeze.asp

If the troops are not in a "combat zone" they do not qualify for combat pay so the troops that are in these dangerous areas that are no longer classified as combat zones are not eligible. I should have worded that better.....my bad.

As for what happens when the time comes....we will see. I don't trust them.

[sgreger1]

C'mon E-Rock you seem smarter than that... I like you man but comments like that really piss me off. The last clause was in jest, were you joking with the whole thing? I don't mean to take things too seriously, so forgive me if it was just a bad joke about gas prices...

On another note, your comment also reminded me of a common geographic deficiency that plagues our country. People, and often news networks too, refer to Afghanistan as the Middle East. I don't mean to play Geography Nazi, but Americans are devastatingly ignorant of Central Asia as an entire region. Afghanistan borders the former Soviet Republics that make up the 7 'stans including Pakistan, which until 65 years ago was part of India. Afghanistan also borders China. So my question is if we were to "level the Middle East" (and I don't think you weren't serious), where do we draw the line? Would Israel be spared? Istanbul? Our strong allies in Jordan? Kazakhstan and Kyrgyzstan, which despite being officially Muslim are direct cultural descendants of Mongolia? The word Arab specifically refers to people of the Arabian peninsula, which are far different culturally, ethnically, and linguistically from the Persians of modern-day Iran and some populations in Central Asia (western Uzbekistan, Turkmenistan and Tajikistan). As much as we lump them together and don't give a shit about their differences, Arabs and Persians hate each others' guts and do not represent each others' interests. Just like a lot of people are completely ignorant to the fact that the Chinese loathe the Japanese with every ounce of their being, yet people don't hesitate to call a Chinese person a "jap", and if corrected might say they really don't give a shit about the difference. That is my point I guess. The more we put any thought to understanding the differences and the history that defines a culture, the more appreciation we have for how and why a given population has arrived at their little place in the world and their situation has been realized. And the more we understand these differences, the more appreciation we have for universal aspects of the human condition (in my opinion). The "middle east" and Central Asia are so much more complex and historically rich than most would care to understand.

K that was my Rodney King "get along" moment. Eric, I'm not trying to go off on you bud. I think you were just joking around, but your post got me thinking. Cheers.

This is so absolutely true. I have always suffered from the same problem most americans do in that I think in overly simplistic terms when it comes to the rest of the world. I envy that you have been able to travel and see some of this first hand. For me I was born in raised in Cali and then spent a brief period in the army only going to other states to train to kill, so my view of things has been very "conditioned" if you will my entire life.

Even Marrying a girl from the Phillipines has opened my eyes to a lot of things that eluded me previously, about how different other cultures are and how even if they seem crazy to you they are no less valid than your own, and I have also learned that at the end of the day we are all part of the same great struggle that every human being must go through. I find it hard to pass judgement on anyone knowing that we all come from the same place and are all going in the same direction, all experiencing the same problems and asking the same questions, we all just deal with it diferently. Some cling to their bibles to rationalize this crazy struggle we all must go through, others bomb an IRS building, and others fly to Haiti to help others in their struggle, but all of these actions stem from the same human problems that we all have, it is unfair for me to have assumed we are all part of different groups when really I think we are all the same person just learning to deal with the same things in different ways.


Even these "New World Order" types are only human and their actions stem from the same mechanisms as yours, they are just dealing with the struggle in their own way.


I was in the emergency room this weekend for something pretty serious and it really got me thinking. I was there laying on the table in pain sure of my death and yet still worrying about little selfish shit like how this was going to affect (ruin) my birthday weekend (I turned 25 on monday). But then I thought about how right down the hall a child was taking his first breath, and I wondered if he understood what it's worth yet, life, our time spent and why we're here on this earth yet, if he understands what he has just been born into and how he will spend the rest of his mortal life dealing with the same struggle and asking the same questions as every other human being that proceeded him. To loosely quote something I once heard, "We can find the answers to the questions that we all seek, but that just depends on how free yall think."

So be free, erase the imaginary borders our leaders have drawn between us, don't allow them to devide us and segregate us by religion and political ideology, realize that every human that has ever died had a life and a feeling of importance, that every terrorist, communist etc has gone through the same struggle as you and they just chose a different path than yours.

I havn't traveled much, but my view on things is changing every day. The more I think about it, the more I realize that all of our differences really just stem from our similarities, from our own egos that we let dominate our lives to the point where we think "our" country is better than yours or that the way I see the universe is more valid than yours.

From the monks seeking enlightenment, to the religions & cults, to science and philosophy, to those who believe in aleins, we all seek the same answers to the same questions. I think what we all need is to just get it together, even on this forum I see too much devision, something I have myself contributed to.


I will no longer be celebrating Bin Ladens death, or the death of any of these terrorists for that matter. Nor will I celebrate the death of any of my enemies. When I was in the army a fellow soldier I really didn't like came into my room and put a gun in his mouth, and I stood there and let him pull the trigger. When his family came and looked me in the eye to ask why I didn't do something to stop it, I deflected like always and effectively said "not my problem". I didn't care that he died, I only cared about the mess he left all over my kitchen. But after a few years and some deep reflection, I wished I had stopped him, I don't know why I let my own ego get in the way of doing what was right, but I know one thing now, the whole world is in the same position as I was in that night, we all have a gun in our collective mouths, and our leaders are arguing over who gets to pull the trigger. Don't be the guy who stands there and just watches it happen, you will regret it later, and the mess will be left for YOU and YOUR children to clean up.



Please, for all the reasons above, and for the sake of humanity, let's stop ragging on Sage and rejoicing in Bin Laden's death. Let's all just enjoy this beautifull struggle together, it is what makes life intiresting and it's what makes us human, but let's just stop beating a dead horse. These are human beings we are talking about.

[Frosted]

This is so absolutely true. I have always suffered from the same problem most americans do in that I think in overly simplistic terms when it comes to the rest of the world. I envy that you have been able to travel and see some of this first hand. For me I was born in raised in Cali and then spent a brief period in the army only going to other states to train to kill, so my view of things has been very "conditioned" if you will my entire life.

Even Marrying a girl from the Phillipines has opened my eyes to a lot of things that eluded me previously, about how different other cultures are and how even if they seem crazy to you they are no less valid than your own, and I have also learned that at the end of the day we are all part of the same great struggle that every human being must go through. I find it hard to pass judgement on anyone knowing that we all come from the same place and are all going in the same direction, all experiencing the same problems and asking the same questions, we all just deal with it diferently. Some cling to their bibles to rationalize this crazy struggle we all must go through, others bomb an IRS building, and others fly to Haiti to help others in their struggle, but all of these actions stem from the same human problems that we all have, it is unfair for me to have assumed we are all part of different groups when really I think we are all the same person just learning to deal with the same things in different ways.


Even these "New World Order" types are only human and their actions stem from the same mechanisms as yours, they are just dealing with the struggle in their own way.


I was in the emergency room this weekend for something pretty serious and it really got me thinking. I was there laying on the table in pain sure of my death and yet still worrying about little selfish shit like how this was going to affect (ruin) my birthday weekend (I turned 25 on monday). But then I thought about how right down the hall a child was taking his first breath, and I wondered if he understood what it's worth yet, life, our time spent and why we're here on this earth yet, if he understands what he has just been born into and how he will spend the rest of his mortal life dealing with the same struggle and asking the same questions as every other human being that proceeded him. To loosely quote something I once heard, "We can find the answers to the questions that we all seek, but that just depends on how free yall think."

So be free, erase the imaginary borders our leaders have drawn between us, don't allow them to devide us and segregate us by religion and political ideology, realize that every human that has ever died had a life and a feeling of importance, that every terrorist, communist etc has gone through the same struggle as you and they just chose a different path than yours.

I havn't traveled much, but my view on things is changing every day. The more I think about it, the more I realize that all of our differences really just stem from our similarities, from our own egos that we let dominate our lives to the point where we think "our" country is better than yours or that the way I see the universe is more valid than yours.

From the monks seeking enlightenment, to the religions & cults, to science and philosophy, to those who believe in aleins, we all seek the same answers to the same questions. I think what we all need is to just get it together, even on this forum I see too much devision, something I have myself contributed to.


I will no longer be celebrating Bin Ladens death, or the death of any of these terrorists for that matter. Nor will I celebrate the death of any of my enemies. When I was in the army a fellow soldier I really didn't like came into my room and put a gun in his mouth, and I stood there and let him pull the trigger. When his family came and looked me in the eye to ask why I didn't do something to stop it, I deflected like always and effectively said "not my problem". I didn't care that he died, I only cared about the mess he left all over my kitchen. But after a few years and some deep reflection, I wished I had stopped him, I don't know why I let my own ego get in the way of doing what was right, but I know one thing now, the whole world is in the same position as I was in that night, we all have a gun in our collective mouths, and our leaders are arguing over who gets to pull the trigger. Don't be the guy who stands there and just watches it happen, you will regret it later, and the mess will be left for YOU and YOUR children to clean up.



Please, for all the reasons above, and for the sake of humanity, let's stop ragging on Sage and rejoicing in Bin Laden's death. Let's all just enjoy this beautifull struggle together, it is what makes life intiresting and it's what makes us human, but let's just stop beating a dead horse. These are human beings we are talking about.

Now that's some post. I wish I had that insight at 25.

[sgreger1]

The idealology behind them attacking us was to attack our "Western" way of life and our freedoms.

I disagree with the sister raping analogy based on motive.....but that is a moot point, I wouldn't invade two countries for revenge as I am not vengeful by nature. I was angry as anybody on September 11 but strangely, I wasn't screaming for Osama Bin Laden's blood.

I am still angry that we had the intelligence to stop this but the government couldn't get its head out of its ass to realize this.

I am angry we went to Iraq after this happened because.......well I still don't know why......I don't think anyone does, really.

But most of all, I am angry that every day since these attacks we have seen our freedoms being taken away to "prevent terrorism".

The only way to beat these fundamental extremists is to be a free country. Never forget......but move on and continue living the way that pisses them off.

I am sure every time the tsa fondles someone's balls, a law restricting our individual rights is passed and the power of this country shifts from the many as a democracy to the few as a racist dictatorship they cheer....

The military should be here, defending our country and special ops should have been given this task in the first place......

Obama did this now because he just allowed combat pay (the trrops in danger are being called peacekeeping force and no longer qualify. **** him. He sends our best patriots over to get shot at in countries we shouldn't have gone to in the first place like we did and then cuts their pay for being there.

I don't normally get political when it comes to the internet but this is one point we all should have our voices heard on.

I agree 100%. The combat pay thing isn't a conspiracy as much as it is just how things work. You get special kinds of combat pay based on how dangerous your specific job is. If you are in a combat zone, you get combat pay, if you are a paratrooper, you get airborne pay, etc etc. I can't really blame this on Obama because this has always been the policy. But you are completely right, I feel like it was all for nothing, and this man's death changes nothing. We were never there to get him in the first place, his death is inconsequential to anything at this point in time.


I have lost friends in this specific struggle, and that made me want to take revenge to the point where I could justify nuking all of Iraq, I signed up ready and willing to go kick in doors of civilian residences just like my own and shoot anyone who even remotely looked like they were holding something shiny, so we all must realize that Osama was himself a soldier who witnessed his own kin being taken as casualties in this stuggle as well, so his jihad against us and our country is no different than my Jihad against him and his country. It's an endless feedback loop of insanity and it makes everyone's struggle harder. 99.999999999% of humans just want to live life and enjoy their family, see their children grow, watch the sunset and ponder the universe, and all of this is disrupted by this constant cycle of violence and revenge.

[LaZeR]

...let's stop ragging on Sage and rejoicing in Bin Laden's death. ....

In one sentence!

Oh wow, my 4000th post!

[EbenezerScrews]

Sex and violence

[Ainkor]

I have lost friends in this specific struggle, and that made me want to take revenge to the point where I could justify nuking all of Iraq, I signed up ready and willing to go kick in doors of civilian residences just like my own and shoot anyone who even remotely looked like they were holding something shiny, so we all must realize that Osama was himself a soldier who witnessed his own kin being taken as casualties in this stuggle as well, so his jihad against us and our country is no different than my Jihad against him and his country. It's an endless feedback loop of insanity and it makes everyone's struggle harder. 99.999999999% of humans just want to live life and enjoy their family, see their children grow, watch the sunset and ponder the universe, and all of this is disrupted by this constant cycle of violence and revenge.

You said it very well sgreger1.

[Frosted]

"Americans insist Osama's burial at sea is a Muslim tradition."

5 Minutes later.

"Americans admit to confusing Muslims with Vikings"

[Bigblue1]

"Americans insist Osama's burial at sea is a Muslim tradition."

5 Minutes later.

"Americans admit to confusing Muslims with Vikings"

LOL! Seriously made me laugh out Loud.

[RobsanX]

Obama Bin Lyin'?

Barrack WhoSlain Osama...

[truthwolf1]

Wag the Bin Laden

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-south-asia-13329078