Confidence in organized religion hits all-time low in Gallup poll

[Crow]

Have you ever heard of this hot little place called HELL?

Hell? What's that?

[wa3zrm]

I've heard the mythology. I like stories as much as the next guy, but I don't conflate stories with reality.

http://www.existence-of-god.com/index.html

[wa3zrm]

Hell? What's that?

That's where we currently are! Don't you know that you are dead and this is hell?

[lxskllr]

http://www.existence-of-god.com/index.html

There's no proof. Data trumps everything, and there isn't a single shred of evidence that supports the existence of a higher being. People frame things with a human perspective. "There's a wooden chair, therefore someone created it". That's an accurate statement, and reflects previous knowledge. Even if we didn't see that /specific/ chair being created, we have enough experience with the creation of furniture to determine with almost 100% certainty that it was created by a human.. "There's a planet, therefore someone created it" doesn't work the same way. The creation of planets has never been observed, so it can't be determined where it came from. Anyone claiming anything else is just making shit up, and it holds no more weight than me saying invisible unicorns dance on my chest when I sleep.

Edit:
What I'm getting at, is the "someone had to make it" meme is a child-like way of looking at the universe. Someone didn't /have to/ make it. Maybe it just is; maybe not too, but there's no evidence for a creator, so acting as if there were gets us nowhere, and constrains our thought to a narrow band, and retards progress.

[wa3zrm]

There's no proof... Anyone claiming anything else is just making shit up, and it holds no more weight than me saying invisible unicorns dance on my chest when I sleep.

Edit:
What I'm getting at, is the "someone had to make it" meme is a child-like way of looking at the universe. Someone didn't /have to/ make it. Maybe it just is; maybe not too, but there's no evidence for a creator, so acting as if there were gets us nowhere, and constrains our thought to a narrow band, and retards progress.

When backed to the wall, I'll use the annoying defense that my type has been using for the generations... "I'll pray for you."

[lxskllr]

When backed to the wall, I'll use the annoying defense that my type has been using for the generations... "I'll pray for you."

It's the thought that counts :^)

[sgreger1]

Have you ever heard of this hot little place called HELL?

You ever heard of a drunken little place called Valhalla?

Hell is an idea created to scare you, like the idea that you may get a lump of cole from santa claus if you don't obey and be a good boy. There is no mythical realm where all bad people or non-christians are tortured for all of eternity, that is ****ing stupid. What about Hades and The Underworld? Why not go there isntead of hell? Why not get 72 virgins when you die?

You see what all of these stories have in common, they are all bogus things to scare you into following the religion in question.

Religions are meme's, and meme's seek to replecate themselves, just like evolution causes organic beings to want to replicate themselves. The meme survives by getting people to spread it's information and by making it rememberable and shocking. The religion meme has done a good job at staying alive for a long time but it's time we kill it. We talk about greek gods and egyptian sun gods like they are nuts, and someday in the future, people will look back and see jesus and allah and all of our new age gods as equally rediculous.

[halocog]

Lol, what I figured would happen in this thread, indeed did happen.

[wa3zrm]

[wa3zrm]

And here's one for PP:

[Crow]

Live and let live is my stance. Find your own path to enlightenment, and so forth.

Personally, I would consider myself an Agnostic. But, I hold Judaism as a school of thought.

... My beliefs are very complex, so I can't exactly explain it in a forum post

-------------

Oh, and for wa3zrm... Jews don't believe in Hell.

The More You Know _-=*

[deadohsky]

Well that would require a long, complicated answer. Really two answers which can be summed up as:

1) on one hand, overall, religion for the most part served to control people and cause conflict. The same can be said of governments, they generally have done more harm than good throughout history, but it doesn't mean they are completely useless.

2)Religion, long long ago, may have been of survival benefit to our early ancestors. The problem with becoming self aware and sentient is that you begin to question what it's all about and why you're here etc. Religion provided a reason to keep on going, as opposed to just offing yourself etc. It was a way for early man to reach into themselves and find power, (believing the power came from some external source like a God). People for a long time could at least have the peace of mind that if they accomplished whatever it was they needed to for their respective religion, that it would all pay off after death, even if life was shit. Religion is also (was also) a community building thing, and from as far back as the record goes we see that even hunter gatherer tribes had spiritual leaders and ceremonies. It's something that brings people together under a common umbrella and belief, which can benefit the group.

These things aren't really needed anyomore as they have been replaced with less arcane things. We now have ways of explaining things with science so believing in gods and gins and fairies isn't required anymore. We have other ways of building community now so going to church isn't the only place to meet new people or mingle with the townsfolk. We don't think as tribes anymore and most people want to all "get along" with all tribes across the world, so there is no need for us to have small groups with the mentality that they are better than the other and that the other should die for believing the wrong thing.


In other words, I think there was a time when religion played some positive role, but for the most of history the bads likely outweighed the good. But the same can be said of government, it has it's uses but over time it has a pretty bad track record. Doesn't mean it didn't serve any purpose at all (I mean it was clearly there for a reason).

Thanks for explaining your point of view. I hadn't really looked too much into the positive of religion on past societies. I've just generally been of the view that religion has been a bane on humans at all times.

I generally just see religion as a promoting ignorance and close-mindedness.

[sgreger1]

And here's one for PP:

Whoever made this video is a whackjob. I hope they are safely secured in a straitjacket somewhere and not harming themselves or society. To think people would willingly join a group or religion that sees tolerance as a bad thing, but sees and "angry" and "wraithfull" god who demands you praise him as a good thing is crazy. Waz3rm, do you believe this? Or is this satire? Between you whackjob christians who hate everyone who isn't part of your group and the muslims who are equally as whacky, I can see why people hate religion nowadays. Your god, were he to exist, is an evil being who should be rebelled against and cursed for his hatred of mankind. God, as he is depicted in the bible, is actually the devil. He is the one who is constantly making problems for humans and causing, nay, inventing the concept of evil and forcing it upon the world. He would send you to a burning pit for eternity for something wrong. Even communists don't do that. Especially considering that he made us so sinful in the first place and then wants to punish us for being who he made us to be.

I hope some day the christian and muslim death cults are extinguished. The hatred and level of ignorance is such that they don't belong in the modern world. You are all barbarians and your God is an oppressor, not a savior. Curse your God and to hell with all who would worship such an evil monster. **** christians, **** muslims, and **** anyone who would wish to bring everyone else down to that level of existence. You do nothing but bring darkness and hatred to our world. And anyone who thinks people are speaking to them from beyond the dead are almost as stupid and ignorant as anyone who believes a youtube video claiming such.

Nothing personal against you Waz3rm, but your religion is a crazy death cult for whackos and people who don't have the capacity to think, and you are the same as a muslim terrorist in your (lack of) logic and hatred for those who are tolerant, normal people.

[Crow]

Waz3rm, do you believe this? Or is this satire?

Whether or not he posted it as satire, the video is hilarious... Dramatic background music and randomly searched images paired with the ramblings of a madman.

Thanks for sharing, Worms