Ten killed in shooting at 'Dark Knight Rises' premiere: local radio

[lxskllr]

Still if a person can buy four guns and over 6000 rounds of ammo in that short period the system is clearly not working.
If a dumbass like that guy couldn't have gotten all those things he wouldn't have killed and injured even close to that amount of people he did now.
Denying guns from citizens has worked well here. And yes someone can kill a man with a ****ing carrot if he/she wants to, but its much easier to do it with guns.

Sure he could have. his method was less effective than explosives, and explosives can be easily made by a dummy, much less a phd candidate. As far as the high capacity magazines goes... Thinking banning them accomplishes anything is liberal magical thinking. The same kind of magic the religious use. Changing magazines isn't a difficult, or time consuming process. It isn't much harder carrying 10 magazines than it is one 100 round magazine. It's also more reliable, because high capacity magazines have issues feeding.

Again, there's nothing to be done. People dying spectacularly doesn't require anything from anybody. When a bus flips overs, and kills dozens of people, we don't ban buses. When an airplane goes down we don't ban airplanes. And when a whole town gets flooded and people drown, we don't ban living near water. Hand wringing accomplishes nothing. The world's dangerous, and that danger can't be removed. No matter how many warning labels, you place, and laws you pass, the world will still dangerous.

[Bigblue1]

I am just astounded at our European friends who are so cool with the government telling them they can not own weapons. As an American the concept is beyond me. Such simple freedoms can't even be comprehended by the rest of the world it seems. I hope they banned axes and knives and anything that can be used to make explosives in all of your respective countries as well.

I second this. Bet the EU wouldn't have banned snus if you all had some guns!

[UsualSnuspects]

Interesting read -- 'specially the part about a well regulated militia:

http://www.twitlonger.com/show/if2nht

[Premium Parrots]

But did you buy them in a 1 and a half month period?

no, it took me about 3 months to track down about 40,000 rounds. but only because I was looking for a deal. that was more than several years ago. Today ammo is in short supply. Can you guess why?

[lxskllr]

Interesting read -- 'specially the part about a well regulated militia:

http://www.twitlonger.com/show/if2nht

A lie of omission is still a lie. Here's the whole thing...

``The project of disciplining all the militia of the United States is as futile as it would be injurious, if it were capable of being carried into execution. A tolerable expertness in military movements is a business that requires time and practice. It is not a day, or even a week, that will suffice for the attainment of it. To oblige the great body of the yeomanry, and of the other classes of the citizens, to be under arms for the purpose of going through military exercises and evolutions, as often as might be necessary to acquire the degree of perfection which would entitle them to the character of a well-regulated militia, would be a real grievance to the people, and a serious public inconvenience and loss. It would form an annual deduction from the productive labor of the country, to an amount which, calculating upon the present numbers of the people, would not fall far short of the whole expense of the civil establishments of all the States. To attempt a thing which would abridge the mass of labor and industry to so considerable an extent, would be unwise: and the experiment, if made, could not succeed, because it would not long be endured. Little more can reasonably be aimed at, with respect to the people at large, than to have them properly armed and equipped; and in order to see that this be not neglected, it will be necessary to assemble them once or twice in the course of a year.

``But though the scheme of disciplining the whole nation must be abandoned as mischievous or impracticable; yet it is a matter of the utmost importance that a well-digested plan should, as soon as possible, be adopted for the proper establishment of the militia. The attention of the government ought particularly to be directed to the formation of a select corps of moderate extent, upon such principles as will really fit them for service in case of need. By thus circumscribing the plan, it will be possible to have an excellent body of well-trained militia, ready to take the field whenever the defense of the State shall require it. This will not only lessen the call for military establishments, but if circumstances should at any time oblige the government to form an army of any magnitude that army can never be formidable to the liberties of the people while there is a large body of citizens, little, if at all, inferior to them in discipline and the use of arms, who stand ready to defend their own rights and those of their fellow-citizens. This appears to me the only substitute that can be devised for a standing army, and the best possible security against it, if it should exist.''

And also this...

f the representatives of the people betray their constituents, there is then no resource left but in the exertion of that original right of self-defense which is paramount to all positive forms of government, and which against the usurpations of the national rulers, may be exerted with infinitely better prospect of success than against those of the rulers of an individual state. In a single state, if the persons intrusted with supreme power become usurpers, the different parcels, subdivisions, or districts of which it consists, having no distinct government in each, can take no regular measures for defense. The citizens must rush tumultuously to arms, without concert, without system, without resource; except in their courage and despair. The usurpers, clothed with the forms of legal authority, can too often crush the opposition in embryo. The smaller the extent of the territory, the more difficult will it be for the people to form a regular or systematic plan of opposition, and the more easy will it be to defeat their early efforts. Intelligence can be more speedily obtained of their preparations and movements, and the military force in the possession of the usurpers can be more rapidly directed against the part where the opposition has begun. In this situation there must be a peculiar coincidence of circumstances to insure success to the popular resistance.

The obstacles to usurpation and the facilities of resistance increase with the increased extent of the state, provided the citizens understand their rights and are disposed to defend them. The natural strength of the people in a large community, in proportion to the artificial strength of the government, is greater than in a small, and of course more competent to a struggle with the attempts of the government to establish a tyranny. But in a confederacy the people, without exaggeration, may be said to be entirely the masters of their own fate. Power being almost always the rival of power, the general government will at all times stand ready to check the usurpations of the state governments, and these will have the same disposition towards the general government. The people, by throwing themselves into either scale, will infallibly make it preponderate. If their rights are invaded by either, they can make use of the other as the instrument of redress. How wise will it be in them by cherishing the union to preserve to themselves an advantage which can never be too highly prized!

http://www.gradesaver.com/the-federa...text/section6/

As far as "assault" weapons go. The founding fathers were talking about state of the art weaponry of the time. They didn't say the people had the right to collect rocks for throwing. They were talking about the best rifles and guns available. As technology increases, the technology available to the citizenry should also increase.

[sgreger1]

Sometimes I have to take the side of Devil's advocate to stir up the discussion.

I am not for banning guns. I just question the need for 100 round magazines and
access to ammo online to a person such as the theater shooter.

This while felons who have done their time can't defend their life and family
with a firearm. Something wrong here.

I can respect that, I'm not of the mind that there should be NO restrictions (though arguably it is always a slippery slope). And this guy was a med student of neuroscience so it's not like he fit the profile for people we don't want being able to own a gun.

Honestly I think the best realistic solution to the gun problem is to make biometric triggers either more common or mandate that all new firearms have them. That way only the one who purchases the gun can fire it, or whoever he gives permission to. It's a little thing that scans your fingerprint and only fires if you are in the database of allowed shooters.

I say this because most of our gun crime is not crimes like this, it is in ghettos where stolen guns with the serial numbers scratched off are sold very cheap and used in gang violence etc. This would almost illuminate that as they wouldn't be able to fire a stolen firearm. Additionally, little timmy columbine wouldn't be able to get into dad's gun closet and go shoot up the school.

This way, everyone can have guns, and we can 100% trace the crime back to the person. We can't ever stop massacres but they aren't an epidemic of any sort in our country, it's common gun crime by criminals that is the problem and biometric firearms would fix it.

[sgreger1]

And you're not allowed to carry a blade unless its necessary for your employment.
Even armed police keep their weapons in an armoury in their vehicle. To take the weapon out they have to get permission from a senior officer.

Good god, it's like something out of 1984 or something. Are you being serious of joking? We in CA have a ban on anything over 6 inches as well, but the whole "you can't carry a knife if it's not part of your occupation is crazy. Every kid in the southern US has an entire knife collection (lots over 6 inches I might add). That would never fly here in a million years. I can't even fathom that that exists. I feel bad for you Europe, I have been pretty anti-america lately but i'm starting to realize that we enjoy a lot more freedom here than is allowed for the common class in many other developed countries.

[lxskllr]

I have been pretty anti-america lately but i'm starting to realize that we enjoy a lot more freedom here than is allowed for the common class in many other developed countries.

That's changing on a daily basis. I almost gave him shit about the UK, but I deleted it after writing because he's only a victim of time. Someone had to be first, and this time it was the UK. The USA is goose stepping right along with them, and will catch up sooner rather than later..

[sgreger1]

Still if a person can buy four guns and over 6000 rounds of ammo in that short period the system is clearly not working.
If a dumbass like that guy couldn't have gotten all those things he wouldn't have killed and injured even close to that amount of people he did now.
Denying guns from citizens has worked well here. And yes someone can kill a man with a ****ing carrot if he/she wants to, but its much easier to do it with guns.

Here we are not willing to give up our freedoms as human beings just to stop some lone whacko every year (1 out of 300 million people). That amount of ammunition is pretty crazy and imo they should keep track of anyone buying huge amounts of ammo. That's just my personal opinion. Lots of people buy huge quantities in bulk so it would be a long list, but maybe at least keep a list of people who are buying in strange patterns. I imagine they already do this for terrorism reasons but don't use the info to stop guys like this.

[wa3zrm]

I can't see why you guys are all in an uproar over 6000 rounds... that's nothing! I go through three bricks (500 rounds per brick) of 22 rounds every month... and that's just for my pocket carry 22. I have several bricks of .38, 9mm, 40 Colt and more shotgun shells (410 & 12 gauge) than you can shake a stick at. I'll bet many of you guys also think targets are round with a bulls-eye or tin cans? I'll bet some of you would be shocked to see how many people at the range(s) use human silhouettes... remember, a head shot brings the bad guy down instantly... you don't want to wing him so he may be able to return fire... or even worse, toss a grenade at you!

[CoderGuy]

Here we are not willing to give up our freedoms as human beings just to stop some lone whacko every year (1 out of 300 million people). That amount of ammunition is pretty crazy and imo they should keep track of anyone buying huge amounts of ammo. That's just my personal opinion. Lots of people buy huge quantities in bulk so it would be a long list, but maybe at least keep a list of people who are buying in strange patterns. I imagine they already do this for terrorism reasons but don't use the info to stop guys like this.

Very well stated.

[lxskllr]

Here we are not willing to give up our freedoms as human beings just to stop some lone whacko every year (1 out of 300 million people). That amount of ammunition is pretty crazy and imo they should keep track of anyone buying huge amounts of ammo. That's just my personal opinion. Lots of people buy huge quantities in bulk so it would be a long list, but maybe at least keep a list of people who are buying in strange patterns. I imagine they already do this for terrorism reasons but don't use the info to stop guys like this.

That particular number for ammo isn't really relevant. That guy used far less than 6,000 rounds. Was it maybe 100? Is that cutoff? Maybe drop it down to 50 to be safe. Of course 50 is a lot too. That's about 4* more than the number of people killed in the theatre. How much is too much? Should ammo be sold one at a time in shrink wrapped, serial numbered pouches with a limit of one per year? If you sold them more frequently than that(one per month maybe?), someone could save up for a year, and have 12 rounds. That's a lot of mayhem they could cause in a mall or something :^/

[wa3zrm]

I'm amazed that no one in the theater was carrying and returned fire. I recall reading a story about some nut that opened up in a church and a female parishioner brought him down with her concealed carry.

[Premium Parrots]

15 years ago there were over 300,000 assault rifles in cali alone. Ya think everyone is going to turn them in?
They might just turn them on instead.

Good god, it's like something out of 1984 or something. Are you being serious of joking? We in CA have a ban on anything over 6 inches as well, but the whole "you can't carry a knife if it's not part of your occupation is crazy. Every kid in the southern US has an entire knife collection (lots over 6 inches I might add). That would never fly here in a million years. I can't even fathom that that exists. I feel bad for you Europe, I have been pretty anti-america lately but i'm starting to realize that we enjoy a lot more freedom here than is allowed for the common class in many other developed countries.

[OregonNative]

Still if a person can buy four guns and over 6000 rounds of ammo in that short period the system is clearly not working.
If a dumbass like that guy couldn't have gotten all those things he wouldn't have killed and injured even close to that amount of people he did now.
Denying guns from citizens has worked well here. And yes someone can kill a man with a ****ing carrot if he/she wants to, but its much easier to do it with guns.

I used to shoot long range rifles in local competitions, and when we used to re-load, we had over 10,000 rounds in various calibers. 6000 rounds isn't that much really. In a country where one can walk into a walmart at 5 am, buy a new rifle, buy a box of ammo (after taking the rifle out to the car), don't be surprised when some people buy up ammo by the thousands.

I'm not insulting you bro, I'm just saying, the United States loves it's guns and I doubt that is going to change. At least not for a very very long time. My grandpa who is 72 still goes out almost every weekend and shoots. One of my fondest memories was teaching my little sister to shoot with a 22. rifle on our grandparents farm one summer. She still goes out and shoots with me once in a while, and I now go hunting with her boyfriend atleast 4-5x a year. It's part of the culture man. I don't mean this as an insult to our brothers & sisters overseas, but it's hard for people who are not from the United States to really understand. It was hard for my German cousins to understand/accept when they visit once or twice a year.