3 killed in shooting near Texas A&M University

[Joe234]

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Another one for the NRA

3 killed in shooting near Texas A&M University


http://www.cnn.com/2012/08/13/justice/texas-am-shooting/index.html

[texastorm]

While we are at it lets ban knives

Woman stabs fiance

And maybe if we ban bad drugs people will stop using them...

Oh wait... we tried that? Sumbi... Hmm I dunno, ban everything and start fresh.

[Ansel]

And maybe if we ban bad drugs people will stop using them...

Oh wait... we tried that?

Now you're using sophistry.

[texastorm]

Now you're using sophistry.

Ok,

name one ban that has worked, then I will name at least five that have not. The only way you can consider that misleading is to claim that this might just be the ban that works. But the definition of insanity... etc.


People who argue for the partial and/or total ban of guns are simply kidding themselves into believing it will accomplish something that historically it has never accomplished. While it may slow down murder by gun, no one can say if it stops any murders. Maybe if we bring back beheadings we can instill some fear, but for goodness sake you cant even spank your children anymore, and since my daily work life involves dealing with crowds I can assure you most kids need a spanking.

Bring back spankings and we can talk.

[Ansel]

lol ok

[squeezyjohn]

I'm not going to get in to US politics ... but guns are very highly regulated here in the UK. It does not mean that illegally traded guns are not used by criminals here ... nor does it mean that the occasional fruit-loop who holds a licence and frequents the local gun club doesn't go on the rampage once in a blue moon ("oh, he just kept himself to himself" a neighbour will say on the news).

What it does mean is that it feels like there are far fewer gun related crimes going on than you have in the states. It also means I FEEL far safer here ... even if I am not less likely to get shot ... does that make sense? If a nation feels less threatened by guns then they act less threatened and are much less likely to do something regrettable in a fit of paranoia.

We have knives here - and we have knife crime. I tend to carry a knife capable of doing someone a lot of damage if used that way ... I keep it razor sharp and carry it for multiple innocent uses - but when I go to an area that I feel less safe then I tend to leave it at home or in a hotel because I think that if I have a weapon like that I could end up in a more dangerous situation if I had access to it.

[whalen]

I think this has more to do with the population at 360 million, you get more deviant behavior. That and the general decline in just about every good thing that keeps people happy.

[Frosted]

You're absoloutely right Squeezy. If you carry a knife and draw it, you need to damn well know how to use it - and actually use it. There's no use wafting it about hoping everybody will go away cause it doesn't work like that.
Like my analogy to me drawing a pistol in NI, I felt more threatened carrying a weapon.

Now, with all these people carrying guns in America and all these shootings, not one member of the public has been able to draw their weapon and stop the massacres. I mean, that was a big argument for having guns. Wasn't it?

[squeezyjohn]

Precisely! Access to guns has never stopped the general public from stopping a determined deranged individual from randomly killing people if they also have a gun. Guns are instant - and they can kill/maim from distance and therefore can detach the user from having to face their victim in the eyes.

Don't get me wrong ... in a perfect world I'd love to have some sort of gun at home to get myself some rabbits and to kill the bloody pigeons that eat all my cabbages. I would view it as an inoffensive thing like my fishing rod really.

BUT - and it's a big butt (sorry!) - I just couldn't have one on the premises even if it were legal. I just haven't been brought up that way. If it came in to my hands when something like a burglary was going on while I was at home I would probably try to use it (I tend to get very indignant when thinking about theft) - and that would either end up with me dead or with a criminal record ...

I just can't see how the right to bear arms would help me as a proper upstanding member of the community in that situation. Talking about it in those terms is just posturing of the worst kind.

[texastorm]

Access to a gun has rarely stopped a crime in the last 100 years, ho hum so freakin what! That is not the argument.

Would banning weapons make the number of killings any different? That should be the question. Not would a ban have saved these people in particular, but would the general number of deaths from murder be different. History doesn't show this.

Anyone who says the answer is a different number better be able to prove they are psychic. The truth is no one knows. What I DO KNOW is that if I wanted to kill you and I could not get a gun, or a knife, or a rock I would eventually grab something that would do it. You cant ban that away. So why start with guns if the outcome is the same. I absolutely hate it when liberals want to ban guns and then want to allow abortions. I absolutely hate it when conservatives want to ban abortions but allow guns. Me I want people to have access to both. I want people to be able to do whatever drug kills them while getting them high, I want people to be able to drink what they want, curse when they feel like it and in general show their ugly selves. Because then people could actually have a chance at figuring out who the hell to stay away from.

Banning anything is simply a waste of time, money, and good brain power that could have been used thinking up a real solution.

[texastorm]

Oh and FYI I dont own a gun, but I dont want someone telling YOU you cant have one.

[Crow]

Another one for the NRA

I'm not enthusiastic about the NRA myself (they ****ed over the medical cannabis community by leaving us to defend ourselves)... But, you can't pin this incident on the NRA. I know this is a tactic being used by some fellow liberals, and it's not right.

It's another unfortunate tragedy. I give my condolences to the friends and families of the victims.

-------------

It also means I FEEL far safer here ... even if I am not less likely to get shot ... does that make sense? If a nation feels less threatened by guns then they act less threatened and are much less likely to do something regrettable in a fit of paranoia.

“Anyone who trades liberty for security deserves neither liberty nor security” - Benjamin Franklin

I understand we have different ideologies, and I'm not attacking you, so don't take the quote personally. I'm just sharing a bit of our (American) collective ideology with you.

[squeezyjohn]

Well thanks for your concern, but I do want someone telling me that I can't have one!

Human nature is not the yardstick by which a civilised society should set it's rules - if the majority (or large minority) want something that is against the good of the general population then they shouldn't be allowed to have it.

I know that that statement is as anti-American as standing up in the 1980's and declaring my house as a communist state - but I don't care ... there are intelligent people and stupid people in every society and going with the majority is not always the right solution because lots of stupid people might have an opinion and theirs is not equal with the considered opinion of an intelligent person with regards to a nation's policies.

You want statistics on a very specific and not really relevant point. I won't be doing that tonight as it's nearly 2am here and I really should go to bed. However - if you must, have a look at this Wikipedia page on murder rates per 100000 of population and then choose important countries to you where you know the gun laws or can easily look it up. Plot the murder rate against the degree of regulation on guns in that country and I'm pretty convinced after a cursory glance that you'll find a correlation between the two that shows that less gun regulation = higher murder rate if you take in to account the general corruption and lawlessness in some countries and massive fear of the state in others. It worked for the 5 countries I tried.

It's lovely that you believe in every member of the human race so much, really it is! My children also do, but all my experience tells me that people can't be trusted with the society they live in without clear boundaries otherwise their selfishness is a threat to the whole society ... and for society to thrive it needs to control it's individuals in certain ways. I believe strongly (due to evidence I have seen) that gun ownership is part of that control that is needed.

Sorry

Squeezy

[squeezyjohn]

One final thing (and please bear in mind I am quite tired but very interested in our differences)

Banning anything is simply a waste of time, money, and good brain power that could have been used thinking up a real solution.

So should we un-ban murder? At one time here in the UK it was not technically illegal, many murders in today's eyes could have been legally justified under the law of the 1300s - but we progressed from that position. I agree that in nearly every situation that we should use our collective resources to find actual solutions rather than knee-jerk reactions which are always short-term in their nature.

I'd love a state somewhere to find a solution to the problems of society by accommodating everyone in the society such that they are all sufficiently educated and have a moral obligation and incentive to live their life by their own conscience rather than by state rules and control but you have to admit that it has NEVER happened. Anywhere. Ever.

True Anarchy is a non-existant Utopia not a reality.

[Premium Parrots]

people have been buying up as much guns and ammo and storeing it all away here in the usa for the last 30 years [or more]. If you sell a gun you only have to keep a record of the transaction for 10 years. When you buy a gun from a licensed arms dealer I don't know how long they have to keep their records. What I'm trying to say is that there is no way the ATF can track down even 1% of the guns by record. If they try to make us turn our guns in at some point......not too many people will be doing it if they bought it from a friend over 10 years ago....thats for sure. And keep in mind that guns are typically kept in the family and handed down thru generations. Theres no record of those guns. I have guns that I've bought from a dealer and if I were forced to turn them in I suppose I would because I have far more guns that are untraceable and the government has no idea that I have them. Don't even think that I would turn in the guns my grandfather and my dad gave me. I love my guns. Luckily the government has no idea what I have. Even the photos I've posted here don't include all the guns I own. They will never be able to round up all the small arms in the usa. .

There are many many gun owners in the usa that have been stockpileing arms for years just in case the government does try to ban them. The government will have a hell of a fight on their hands if they try too take them away from us.