How are we supposed to take Sweden seriously?

[squeezyjohn]

The End of the World is Nigh ... Sweden makes a mockery of American Christian Holidays festival in order to send free goats to hot countries where muslims might live.

Some ignorant, xenophobic people have been reported as saying that they don't want anybody who lives in a poor, hot country that they don't understand to get the free goats at the expense of the sanctity of the day when their messiah was supposedly born (because it was definitely the 25th December despite the fact that the modern calendar didn't exist 2000 years ago). One was heard to say "I didn't work hard all my life and pay my tax dollars in order for some Swedish as***les to give goats to brown people who are probably all terrorists ... this is Holidays for Christ's sake! Is nothing sacred? ".

[taffyjock]

You don't mean the poor backwack middle east, birthplace of jewish/Christian & Islamic religion?

The Jesus who threw the traders out the temple for being materialistic, surly not.

[blotgode]

Translated with Google....

Merry Christmas - the most pagan of celebrations!
Christmas tree

I think it's pretty hilarious that there are still people who believe that Christmas has to do with Jesus. For the course not. It has in fact been celebrated Christmas here in the Nordic region for over 2000 years. The word Christmas has nothing to do with Jesus or Christianity to do. In other countries, was renamed if the Christian Mass - but we did not here in Scandinavia. We have retained the old pre-Christian, pagan concept of the winter solstice celebration. Some couples "Christmas" to "Jólnir" of all Odin's name - Jolner occurs precisely on the darkest night of the year - but the most common is to connect it to årshjulet, it has to do with the new beginning at the wheel - the annual cycle.

The winter solstice has been celebrated for thousands of years throughout Europe, and has been kept as the year's most sacred time in many places since the Stone Age. So when the church wanted to recruit members made according to tried and tested practice - it took over the customs of the previous religions. And the holiest time must of course be replaced with something really cool - so then stabbed man to Jesus's birthday. The fact that it was several months fault was not so important.

Backlight

It is in fact inconceivable that Jesus would be born around Christmas (if he existed at all in reality, which I strongly doubt), since the tax losses at the time, took place at completely different times. Modern research shows rather that Jesus (if he existed) was born around Easter, five years earlier than estimated (we would then actually be in the year 2013 now, about to go after Christ's birth as fixed point). So - to celebrate the birth of Jesus at Christmas time is just a pretext to annex the largest festival in Europe - Winter Solstice. A poor camouflage, simply.

You should be really careful so is precisely the date December 25 something church stole from several of the most popular religions around the Mediterranean. The Persians celebrated Mithras' birthday on December 25th. The Greeks celebrated Bacchus. The Egyptians believed that Osiris birthday. The Romans also celebrated their saturnalia, the week before the 25th December. But those in power behind the Christian church did not have competition, so therefore slain man a lot Mithrasdyrkare. and so annexed to the birthday and made it to Jesus's birthday instead. Practically.

Christmas is not mentioned in the Bible, not the New Testament - the "Christian" celebration of Christmas was introduced by the Church during the 300th century as a derivative of pagan rites. In fact, some branches of Christianity have completely banned the Christmas celebration as any un-Christian Gentile. It would therefore be more honest of the Christians to recognize that every year participate in non-Christian, pagan rites, rather than to assert that it is a Christian festival - which it then not.

the plot

And looking a little closer - what does a normal Christmas celebrations today in Sweden? We meet whole families, eat and drink a lot of good, and give each other gifts. What does that have to do with Jesus? Nothing. However resembles Christmas celebrations strongly about the customs and traditions that existed long before Christianity destructive inroads into the north. From Roman times there are written down the Northmen (ie long before the Viking Age) at midwinter gathered and partied and drank Christmas - as it was called. They ate and drank and shouted - "Christmas, Christmas, Christmas, Christmas!".

In practice, all the original customs and traditions that are linked to the Christmas totally pagan - the Christmas tree, wreaths on the door, hanging of mistletoe from the ceiling, exchanging of gifts, and much more. Julegrisen is of course a tribute to Frey's boar Gyllenborst. Pigs have been sacrificed to gudamakterna and eaten around Christmas for thousands of years. We set up straw animals under the tree, symbolizing Thor's goats Tanngrissner and Tanngjostnir. And so we are exhibiting a bowl of porridge to the gnomes and little people. How Christian is that?

Lucia

Not to speak of saffron celebration. We eat Lucia buns and solbröd, and we dance with Freya (Saffron Bride). Lucia celebration is ancient, but one does not go very far back in time to find a completely different way to celebrate saffron, than they cleaned and puttinuttiga luciatåg we Seer nowadays. Enough was lussetåg, but then it was lussepär or saffron bride - lucifers bride, the priests used to mention Freya - who led wild train in the villages, the participants danced and shouted, with sooty faces. The most beautiful of the women in the village dressed in only a long straw, and danced with all the young men. All to celebrate the return of light.

The only thing one can say with great certainty is that this ancient pagan rite with saffron celebration does not have a thing to do with something insane women on an Italian island, which according to legend was the bizarre assault on himself by putting out his own eyes - to someone you thought she was enchanting eyes. Talk about overreacting. And - talk about poor after construction. Far too farfetched to any ONE SINGLE intelligent man should go about it ...

The church shook up the forgotten saints out of dusty tomes, because her name was immediately reminded of "Saffron". Our contemporary, "traditional" Lucia celebration, as it looks with white robes, red belts and light, is otherwise made up of Skansen in the late 1800s, and finally the consolidation of a Lucia competition in Stockholm's Daily, in 1927. As originally was the.

vintersejd

To celebrate saffron at 13 December due to the winter solstice was on December 13, but you still had the Julian calendar, and when they switched to the Gregorian calendar in 1753 moved saffron celebration nine days back. But you still continued to celebrate the same festivals, as it was customary. And so we got a new feast on the new date of the winter solstice.

Interestingly enough, this fact that we Swedes celebrate New Year three times. The winter solstice is the real New Year's, and it is celebrated on Christmas - as we celebrate moreover, is still the old winter solstice date of saffron, and so we almanac New Year when we leave in December and again going into January. And is it genuine hardcore pagans (as we in our family), so celebrate of course also the winter solstice according to astronomical calculations (usually 21 December), by example, sejda, fire and singing around a fire in the forest, preferably in a holy place, of course, invoking Odin and the Norns, the bid if it åstundande year. A fourth point in time, that is. Here we celebrate the New Year properly!

altar

So when you celebrate Christmas - send our ancient pagan gods and goddesses a thought!

Hail Odin! Merry Christmas!

[taffyjock]

That was a great read blotgode, my belief is that 99% of religion past & present stem from our stone age past. Using cosmological events as a primitive farming calendar & stories were used to explain when to plant crops, lamb, what wild fruits where ripe & when etc.

Over the millennia as countries invaded others, instead of replacing entire stories, which is difficult for populations to accept, they borrowed bits from both &.created offshoots.

Chrishna, mithra & Buddah, & others have remarkably similiar births & life stories as Jesus it's hard not to see they all influence each other.

[squeezyjohn]

Yeah ... it's cold and depressing in the Northern countries at midwinter ... so they saved up all their food and had a big party to see their spirits through the hard times, it makes sense. Midsummer and the equinoxes used to be very important too - but they were not hijacked by religions - and ultimately used as a tool of power against the very people the celebrations were designed to serve.

My original post was a joke by the way ... did you like the goats?

[taffyjock]

The cold & dark I can put up with, but what monster decided to start the tradition of celebrating (or accurately endure) it with family.