Did you remember to turn your clock forward?

[texasmade]

[quote="Judge Faust"]

My beloved hunting rifle, one of several, if needed for protection, can pick someone off at 300 yards. And it will be in MY neighborhood and I will have the advantage. Hence, the reason our military has been training in urban areas for the last 10 years. The military will have to think twice before going after its own citizens. We ARE too well armed. And our military knows it.
Sadly, the gap is closeing quickly tho.


Sure our government has us out powered by the means of more powerfull and smarter weapons, but they have to respect our citizens somewhat because we actually have more small arms than the government and there are alot more citizens than military. And some of the citizens are have some of the big guns too. You better believe it. If our government wants to take total control they will have to fight in OUR neighborhoods that we know inside and out. The military will be at a great disadvantage in this reguard. Now don't say that they will simply bomb the crap out of the citizens because that wouldn't happen at all. The government doesn't want to rebuild the infrastructure of their own country.

I have a couple issues with you argument:

1) If the government decides to take you out, small arms aren't going to cut it. You may very well be able to hit a stationary target at 300 yards, but when going up against military snipers and bombers, I would wager good money on the snipers and bombers...

2) Your words are just words. None of you is going to go up against the government. Do you recall the past 8 years? Do you remember the tyranny of the genocidal fascist Emperor Bush II? If his reign didn't motivate you to take up arms against the government, nothing else will. If you're willing to be ruled by a complete idiot doing his damnedest to channel Hitler's ghost, your entire argument falls apart.

ok 1) homemade bombs can be made from just about anything...trust ive researched it and been trained to do it...improvised weapons....rifles,small arms,du rounds....can all easily be attained by civilians...trust me i know people that sell them legally and not


2) its not just words, ive discussed this with people i know and we have a "small" arsenal that can be accessed quickly in time of an emergency....enough ammunition and guns to supply 500+ people with a main weapon and side arm...not including materials needed to make bombs,grenades,etc..

if indeed the government does start ****ing up bad enough...it is our duty to overthrow it and establish a new...most people talk about it but are to scared to do anything ..but i am one of the few that would be willing to die if i knew that it would start a revolution and turn this country around and build it from the ground up in the time of a national failure of the government....

i dont just speak words...thats not what someone like me does...i have no understanding of pain or hurt in the normal sense because of my disorder..(ASPD look it up)..i look at that as a blessing because if i did i wouldnt be able to write the papers i write or the poems i write...and i damn sure wouldnt have joined the marines...my disorder is something that is rare...and trust me...when i say that if the day comes to step up and take charge of a guerilla task force and overthrow a broken and abusive government i will be the first to do so...

i have an expertise in military tactics i have studied it for many years..and have always been good at strategy..ive read and study about every war i can think of and will continue to do so because i dont like losing...

ima narcissistic,cold hearted,disciplined,indifferent person...ask me if i give a **** about life if it means that it will break the chains of oppression and start a new government thats better for the people of this country...no i dont...and i will say it as many times as needed


ive studied marx's writings...as well as many other peoples...every type of government sounds good in theory...none work on their own....i promote anarchy...not chaos...there's a difference...

and ill be damned if i let any government try to take away my unalienable rights...**** that shit...im pissed right now so im ending this rant with this...when the day comes ill be ready and you will see resistance...dont think i speak hollow words...im as serious as the grave

[kum]

ah, paranoia and conspiracy theories. where do the lizardmen and Hitler's base of clones under Antartica come in?

[texasmade]

paranoia keeps soldiers and marines alive...as long as its controlled and couple with intuition...and goverments failing and becoming opressive in nature are not conspiracy theories
its happened throughout history

so with respect do some research before you open your mouth and end up looking like an ass

[Sal1000us]

Stand down but be ready soldier. In the meantime do not play with the combination of Ephedrine, red phosphorus and iodine crystals and no reading of anarchist cookbook, there are more advanced cookbooks.

[texasmade]

military training is much better than any books you can find
ive had it i know
and there are books published by military experts
ive read them also
i know my shit
i just dont like it when someone says that citizens wont do anything and will just bend over and let the government **** them

[Sal1000us]

They think we showld just follow a status quo scenario and be happy too, just like them!

[texasmade]

*sigh*...im gonna take a break and come back to this later...need to calm down some...im gonna go finish watching fringe

[Sal1000us]

and I have to go and do my weekly exercise, remove a ton of damn snow again

[kum]

you realise, if there weren't for your government, you probably wouldn't be here, right? there would be no US, for a start. you Americans of all people should have some respect for your government. they are tyrannical indeed, but only to the rest of the world. and they're ****ing with the rest of the world to make YOUR life better. sure, they take care of the elites first, but "ordinary" people are in the system too and get their piece of the cake.

also, you cops and soldiers received your training from the government. the government is paying you. the government is giving you oportunity to go to college. etc.

the government also gives you the right to bear arms. don't fool yourself, if they wanted to, they would take them away from you and there would be nothing you could do. what is a state? Max Weber : an entity which claims a monopoly on the legitimate use of physical force on a particular territory. it is your privilege, not your right. just look at other countries around the world. most people don't have that privilege. and no one complains. there are far more important rights and privileges to fight for that to have 30 guns in your home and go shoot when you want to. i sure as hell wouldn't like to have that privilege. i don't want my PTSP neighbour to have that privilege. or any other mentally unstable person. i don't want an idiot i'm arguing with over the parking space to have a shotgun in a car. i don't want a nervous steroid pumped guy in a gym to have a gun in his bag. etc.

i choose the privilege of not having to pay to doctors and have my medical care, over the privilege to pose with an M-16 and dream of overthrowing the tyrannical government. i choose to have my child properly medically treated for free (actually, for the taxpayers' money), that to have him be able to collect guns and exchange ammo with other kids when he turns 18.

the government is the lesser of evils. it's far from perfect, but it keeps an organized structure. without it, people would kill each other, we're not evolved enough to keep our agressive nature at bay and have the "community of the people". and funny enough, your gun obsessions and posing just proves that to me.

i'm an anarchist at heart, the absence of hierarchy is what i dream of. but i'm also a realist and i know it's not possible yet. and it sure as hell won't be achieved by accumulating tons of guns.

also, the American "right wing anarchism" is the weirdest bunch i've ever come across and their ideas are completely paradoxal and unreal, but that's a story too long to go into now.

/rant

[texasmade]

ok you're saying that without the government people would just kill each other...turn on the news what do you see.MURDER...not just from guns no most murders arent...try blugeonings,stabbings,drownings,poisons...

guns make it easier yes but it also makes it easier to defend yourself if you have one...someone might say...buy a BFV...do you really want to carry around 20-45 pounds of upper body armor everyday...no i sure as hell dont

lets put it this way...if the government allowed it...people would hunt down and eliminate the murderers,rapists,and molesters..sure more would come up sometime...the samething would happen...

you are right..there are more important things to argue about...but its not just about having the right to own 30 guns that you shoot for fun...its about the right to defend your life..which you cant do all to well if they have a gun and you dont...

by clinical standards I am mentally unstable...not crazy just lacking of most emotions...i own guns,i shoot guns,ive been trained to kill,do you see me going on a ****ing rampage...no

and on the response of anarchy...most people have enough common sense to just live their life...the few that dont would quickly be weeded out by the superior people in the community..this is my opinion...it could be done..and should be done...but the media and government would call it "treason" and "sedition" even when it starts to fail and it becomes the peopes duty to abolish it...

they would make a revolution look like the worst thing ever...and i bet soon enough one might have to be started..i only hope that it doesnt come to that






and with that i will no longer take part in a pointless thread that will get nowhere because everyone has an opinion and feels that theirs is superior to the last man's


end rant

[kum]

how can "people" hunt down and eliminate murderers, rapists etc? how would that practically happen? who would do it? lynching in the streets? you put too much faith into people... first of all, it's not that easy to discover who did the crime. second, the "people" would soon turn on people they don't like for this or that reason. you mentioned history... well just look how many times the lynch mob did the right thing.

it's job of the police. and they do it. sometimes not too well, but they do. no lynch mob can do that.

as for guns... pro-guns and pro-gun control people both have valid arguments. but for me, i don't think it's an issue to theoretize, we have enough examples in real life to observe and draw conclusions. fact : countries with gun control have by far less crime and murders than those who don't. i'm talking western countries here. we could go into endless discussions about why, but that's just how it is. and it's enough for me. as i said, i'm glad i don't have a right to have a gun. actually, i do. but it's not easy to get the permission, i need to pass loads of tests and even then i have many restrictions - i can't show it in public or use it when and how i want. i can defend myself if the other person has a gun too, that i can do. and that's fine by me.

yes, murder will always be here. but without any structural order, it wouldn't be just murder, it would be mass extermination. yes, the "strongest" would survive... and soon they would see they'll survive easier if they form groups... the first group that organizes itself would be stronger, so others would also organize themselves too to compete with them... so we would have groups again... as the groups grow, the most skilled individuals would be proclaimed leaders to keep things organized and lead them... (because, fact : only small groups can be organized with no hierarchy)... and they of course would first take care of themselves and those closest to them... and voila! you have the hierarchy again. it's just human nature.

[Judge Faust]

Texasmade -

Your argument is nonsensical. Do you really suppose that a successful revolution involves the citizenry taking on its own armed forces? For an allegedly well-read individual, that is a very ignorant view.

In modern times, no revolution has succeeded without the involvement of the nation's own soldiers. Take my personal favorite revolution, for example - the 1917 Bolshevik Revolution.

Do you suppose that it succeeded because teeming masses of peasants and factory workers took on the Tsarist army? No. It succeeded because Lenin and Trotsky were able to bring the army onto their side. One by one, the military garrisons of all major cities switched their allegiance from the Emperor to the Communists. The concluding moment of the Bolshevik Revolution came when the Communists stormed the Emperor's Winter Palace. Do you know how the signal for that was given? By cannon fire from the Cruiser Aurora, an ex-Tsarist battleship that had recently joined the Communists.

The point is that, without military involvement, revolutions are no longer likely to succeed. It doesn't matter whether or not you can field 500 gun-toting southern rednecks. A single cruise missile could take the lot of you out. My advice is: before beginning your anarchist revolution, make damn sure that you're got the army on your side.

[Judge Faust]

by clinical standards I am mentally unstable...not crazy just lacking of most emotions...i own guns,i shoot guns,ive been trained to kill,do you see me going on a ****ing rampage...no

Er... so you are an insane anarchist killer with guns... No offense, but yes, I can certainly see you going on a rampage. If you were my client, I certainly wouldn't put much effort into keeping you out of prison. Or a mental institution.

Once again, since I only have your words to base my opinion upon, I may be wrong. But the way you present yourself makes you seem like a clear menace to society. I would think twice before leaving any children or small animals in your general vicinity...

and on the response of anarchy...most people have enough common sense to just live their life...the few that dont would quickly be weeded out by the superior people in the community..this is my opinion...it could be done..and should be done...but the media and government would call it "treason" and "sedition" even when it starts to fail and it becomes the peopes duty to abolish it...

People need to be "weeded out?" Those words send shivers down my spine. Many of my own relatives were "weeded out" by the Nazis following the invasion of the Soviet Union.

Further proof that fascism is still alive and well.

[TBD]

Texasmade -



The point is that, without military involvement, revolutions are no longer likely to succeed. It doesn't matter whether or not you can field 500 gun-toting southern rednecks. A single cruise missile could take the lot of you out. My advice is: before beginning your anarchist revolution, make damn sure that you're got the army on your side.

How about 5,000,000 gun- toting patriots? The US military would not fire cruise missiles on American soil. Think of the collateral damage. History has proven that small groups can hold off disproportionate numbers of military forces. Your beloved soviet army couldn't beat a relatively small group of afghani rebels in ten years.
Revolting , with arms, against the military does not have good prospects.Revolting, with arms, against the Government does. The military will only follow the Government against it's own people for a certain period of time. After they will join the "rebels" or at least enough of them will to even out the advantage the Government has. Which is exactly what happened in Russia. A small group started it and it grew until the numbers favored the rebels.
I find it intellectually dishonest that you idolize Stalin, Lenin and Trotsky , while demonizing the American government , specifically Bush, for doing the same thing. I guess like all those who share your political leanings you believe it matters who is doing the damage. If you like communism so much feel free to move to a communist country, say Cuba or China. Facisim has a lot more in common with communism/socialism than it does democracy. National Socialists is the true name of the NAZI party.

[Judge Faust]

i choose the privilege of not having to pay to doctors and have my medical care, over the privilege to pose with an M-16 and dream of overthrowing the tyrannical government. i choose to have my child properly medically treated for free (actually, for the taxpayers' money), that to have him be able to collect guns and exchange ammo with other kids when he turns 18.

the government is the lesser of evils. it's far from perfect, but it keeps an organized structure. without it, people would kill each other, we're not evolved enough to keep our agressive nature at bay and have the "community of the people". and funny enough, your gun obsessions and posing just proves that to me.

Excellent point, Kum!

Complete self-sufficiency is a uniquely American myth. These so-called anarchists (also Libertarians and their ilk) choose to completely disregard the fact that humans, like all greater apes, are herd animals. We do not function well without clear hierarchies and leadership.

Anarchy is a cute idea. Unfortunately, it just doesn't work well. Ask the Somalis...