Yup, more Global Warming info for alarmists to ignore.

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts
  • Slydel
    Member
    • Mar 2008
    • 421

    Yup, more Global Warming info for alarmists to ignore.

    Shall the ordained priest, Al "The Nobel Prize Winner" (cough) Gore, keep getting rich off of this hoax? Will his religion die when the truth is told again and again?

    Please read the following article (this information has been around for years. Crichton's book, State of Fear, was torn apart because the "religious" did not want to believe it. Notice my subjective bias. What do you think?............

    What if global-warming fears are overblown? (long post sorry..)

    NEW YORK (Fortune) -- With Congress about to take up sweeping climate-change legislation, expect to hear more in coming weeks from John Christy, director of the Earth System Science Center at University of Alabama-Huntsville.

    A veteran climatologist who refuses to accept any research funding from the oil or auto industries, Christy was a lead author of the 2001 Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change report as well as one of the three authors of the American Geophysical Union's landmark 2003 statement on climate change.

    Yet despite those green-sounding credentials, Christy is not calling for draconian cuts in carbon emissions. Quite the contrary. Christy is actually the environmental lobby's worst nightmare - an accomplished climate scientist with no ties to Big Oil who has produced reams and reams of data that undermine arguments that the earth's atmosphere is warming at an unusual rate and question whether the remedies being talked about in Congress will actually do any good.

    Christy's critics in the blogosphere assume his research is funded by the oil industry. But Christy has testified in federal court that his research is funded by the National Oceanic & Atmospheric Administration and that the only money he has ever received from corporate interests - $2,000 from the Competitive Enterprise Institute for penning a chapter of a global warming book in 2002 - he gave away to a charity, the Christian Women's Job Corps.
    0:00 /3:37Duke: 80% less carbon by 2050

    His most controversial argument is that the surface temperature readings upon which global warming theory is built have been distorted by urbanization. Due to the solar heat captured by bricks and pavement and due to the changing wind patterns caused by large buildings, a weather station placed in a rural village in 1900 will inevitably show higher temperature readings if that village has, over time, been transformed into small city or a suburban shopping district, Christy says.

    The only way to control for such surface distortions is by measuring atmospheric temperatures. And when Christy and his co-researcher Roy Spencer, a former NASA scientist now teaching at UA-Huntsville, began analyzing temperature readings from NOAA and NASA satellites, they found much slighter increases in atmospheric temperatures than what was being recorded on the surface. Christy and Spencer also found that nearly all the increases in average surface temperatures are related to nighttime readings - which makes sense if bricks and pavement are in fact retaining heat that would otherwise be dispersed.

    In testimony to the House Ways and Means Committee in February, Christy displayed a chart showing central California temperature trends for both the developed San Joaquin Valley and the largely undeveloped Sierra foothills. "The daytime temperatures of both regions show virtually no change over the past 100 years, while the nighttime temperatures indicate the developed Valley has warmed significantly while the undeveloped Sierra foothills have not," Christy told the committee.

    I recently spoke with Christy about his controversial research.

    Why did you help write the 2001 IPCC report and the 2003 AGU statement on climate change if you disagreed with their fundamental conclusions?

    With the 2001 IPCC report, the material in there over which I had control was satisfactory to me. I wouldn't say I agreed with other parts. As far as the AGU, I thought that was a fine statement because it did not put forth a magnitude of the warming. We just said that human effects have a warming influence, and that's certainly true. There was nothing about disaster or catastrophe. In fact, I was very upset about the latest AGU statement [in 2007]. It was about alarmist as you can get.

    When you testified before Ways and Means, did you have any sense that committee members on either side were open to having their minds changed? Or are views set in stone at this point?

    Generally people believe what they want to believe, so their minds will not change. However, as the issue is exposed in terms of economics and cost benefit - in my view, it's all cost and no benefit - I think some of the people will take one step backward and say, Let me investigate the science a little more closely.

    In laymen's terms, what's wrong with the surface temperature readings that are widely used to make the case for global warming?

    First is the placement of the temperature stations. They're placed in convenient locations that might be in a parking lot or near a house and thus get extra heating from these human structures. Over time, there's been the development of areas into farms or buildings or parking lots. Also, a number of these weather stations have become electronic, and many of them were moved to a place where there is electricity, which is usually right outside a building. As a result, there's a natural warming tendency, especially in the nighttime temperatures, that has been misinterpreted as greenhouse warming.

    Are there any negative consequences to this localized warming?

    It's a small impact, but there is an indication that major thunderstorms are more likely to form downwind of major cities like St. Louis and Atlanta. The extra heating of the city causes the air to rise with a little more punch.

    Have you been able to confirm your satellite temperature readings by other means?

    Weather balloons. We take satellite shots at the same place where the balloon is released so we're looking at the same column of air. Our satellite data compares exceptionally well to the balloon data.

    During your House Ways and Means testimony, you showed a chart juxtaposing predictions made by NASA's Jim Hansen in 1988 for future temperature increases against the actual recorded temperature increases over the past 20 years. Not only were the actual increases much lower, but they were lower than what Hansen expected if there were drastic cuts in CO2 emissions - which of course there haven't been. [Hansen is a noted scientist who was featured prominently in Al Gore's global warming documentary, "An Inconvenient Truth."] Hansen was at that hearing. Did he say anything to you afterwards?

    We really don't communicate. We serve on a committee for NASA together, but it only deals with specific satellite issues. At the Ways and Means hearing, he was sitting two people down from me, but he did not want to engage any of the evidence I presented. And that seems to be the preferred tactic of many in the alarmist camp. Rather than bring up these issues, they simply ignore them.

    (Contacted by Fortune, Hansen acknowledges that his 1988 projections were based on a model that "slightly" overstated the warming created by a doubling in CO2 levels. His new model posits a rise of 3 degrees Celsius in global temperatures by 2100, vs. 4.2 degrees in the old one. Says Hansen, "The projections that the public has been hearing about are based on a climate sensitivity that is consistent with the global warming rate of the past few decades." Christy's response: "Hansen at least admits his 1988 forecasts were wrong, but doesn't say they were way wrong, not 'slightly,' as he states." Christy also claims that even Hansen's revised models grossly overestimated the amount of warming that has actually occurred.)

    I know you think there's been something of a hysteria in the media about melting glaciers. Could you explain?

    Ice melts. Glaciers are always calving. This is what ice does. If ice did not melt, we'd have an ice-covered planet. The fact is that the ice cover is growing in the southern hemisphere even as the ice cover is more or less shrinking in the northern hemisphere. As you and I are talking today, global sea ice coverage is about 400,000 square kilometers above the long-term average - which means that the surplus in the Antarctic is greater than the deficit in the Arctic.

    What about the better-safe-than-sorry argument? Even if there's a chance Gore and Hansen are wrong, shouldn't we still take action in order to protect ourselves from catastrophe, just in case they're right?

    The problem is that the solutions being offered don't provide any detectable relief from this so-called catastrophe. Congress is now discussing an 80% reduction in U.S. greenhouse emissions by 2050. That's basically the equivalent of building 1,000 new nuclear power plants all operating by 2020. Now I'm all in favor of nuclear energy, but that would affect the global temperature by only seven-hundredths of a degree by 2050 and fifteen hundredths by 2100. We wouldn't even notice it. To top of page
    First Published: May 14, 2009: 11:15 AM ET
  • Starcadia
    Member
    • May 2008
    • 646

    #2
    I'm not a climatologist, so my only logical choice is to stay open-minded and apolitical about it. What I do like is that more attention is being paid to being kinder to our planet, there's an increasing awareness of our place in the ecosystem, and we have new incentives to find higher-minded alternatives to the ways we consume. That's all progress to me, and to everybody I assume, whether or not a real crisis is occurring.

    Comment

    • Slydel
      Member
      • Mar 2008
      • 421

      #3
      I do like the idea that people are more aware about keeping our country and world clean. I recycle all of my metals and glass while burning all of my waste paper. My wife and I use cloth diapers. We do all of this mostly for economic reasons, but I understand the need to reuse packaging from purchased products. I conserve energy, again mostly for economic reasons. My concern is that our politicians are thinking about doing our country a disservice by forcing a tax on consumers of energy. This could put the economy in further peril, and take more money out of the pockets of individuals. One argument is that it will create more jobs. At what cost? Why don't we look to some European nations to get a better idea of what has and has not worked? Examples: more nuclear energy, cap and trade, more fuel efficient vehicles, better home construction (smaller houses as well?)...This can be done at the political level as well. What good qualities of the socialist state can be instituted without further bankrupting the country, putting people out of work, and increasing taxes on those still working?

      Comment

      • Condor
        Member
        • Sep 2008
        • 752

        #4
        I thought the global warming thing was proven to be hoax-like. Didnt they find the official measuring thermometers in places that were getting hot (like in a box with a light bulb, for example), and that tainted the sample readings? I know that was exposed. I thought they have moved to calling it "Climate Change" now, because there is proof the earth is cooling? I'm no climatologist either, but FWIW, after reading all of that, I don't put much stock in the "global warming/climate change". Its just another excuse for the government to try to step in and make decisions for us, and place restrictions on us. Or they want to "Carbon Tax" us. Just my .02.

        Comment

        • lxskllr
          Member
          • Sep 2007
          • 13435

          #5
          The climate is definitely changing, but the cause is open for debate. I take the same position as Starcadia. Whether the change is caused by humans or not, assuming it's human caused will be better for everybody in the long term.

          I'm ambivalent about nuclear energy. You have the waste issue with nukes, and there's only so much fissionable material available, so it's more a bandaid solution than a permanent fix.

          Comment

          • Badfish74
            Member
            • May 2009
            • 1035

            #6
            Nice article Slydel. I try to do what I can to recycle and burn trash, but also for economical reasons. One more example of dishonest politicians...oops did I let the secret out?!

            Comment

            • Slydel
              Member
              • Mar 2008
              • 421

              #7
              Well, I have been doing some reading regarding Christy and Spencer. It is pretty ugly reading information about them on the internet. Their first satellite model had an error. Christy and Spencer corrected the model, while many complained about their error, feeling that Christy and Spencer could not be trusted to bring about an objective, error free model. These same people again and again state that Christy and Spencer are making money from "Big Oil", which has not been substantiated. I say even if the satellite model was to be thrown out of the equation for his argument, what about the temperature data comparing the developed San Joaquin Valley and the largely undeveloped Sierra foothills? On a side note, I don't know how true this is but, Gores net worth from leaving office has increased from $2 million to $100 million. Is this unusual for an ex-VP? That is quite a jump in 8 years. I think he might have a vested interest in his own green technology since he is making so much from it?

              Comment

              • Sal1000us
                Member
                • Jan 2009
                • 384

                #8
                In addition to the steady flow of six-figure speaking gigs ($175,000 a pop), Gore has become an insider at two of the hottest companies on the planet: at Google, where he signed on as an adviser in 2001, pre-IPO (and received stock options now reportedly worth north of $30 million), and at Apple, where he joined the board in 2003 (and got stock options now valued at about $6 million).

                He also enjoyed a big payday as vice chairman of an investment firm in L.A., and, more recently, started a cable-television company and an asset-management firm, both of which are becoming quiet forces in their fields.

                Financial disclosure documents released before the 2000 election put the Gore family's net worth at $1 million to $2 million. Available data indicate a net worth well in excess of $100 million in 2008.

                Many people are saying that Al Gore has helped to create a fictitious catastrophe, then told everybody what the solutions have to be, and then put himself in a position to capitalize on the hype. It’s not only seriously dishonest, but many people and industries are going to suffer in the wake of this hype while Gore and Big Green bring in millions (and in some cases, billions) of dollars in green money.

                Comment

                • HK11
                  Member
                  • May 2009
                  • 631

                  #9
                  It's all about the carbon tax.

                  Comment

                  • Link
                    Senior Member
                    • Aug 2008
                    • 393

                    #10
                    http://www.amazon.com/Green-Hell-Env.../dp/1596985852

                    Comment

                    • justintempler
                      Member
                      • Nov 2008
                      • 3090

                      #11
                      Envioremental Science Institute
                      The University of Texas at Austin

                      http://www.esi.utexas.edu/outreach/prevlectures.html

                      Recommended:
                      http://www.esi.utexas.edu/outreach/ols/lectures/Barron/

                      The Changing Debate on Global Warming
                      by Dr. Eric J. Barron
                      Dean, Jackson School of Geosciences
                      The University of Texas at Austin

                      Comment

                      • Stargazer
                        Member
                        • Aug 2007
                        • 225

                        #12
                        it doesn't really matter if global warming is a hoax or not.
                        We have to cut are dependency on fossil fuels anyway,
                        because they run out! It's as easy as that, our economy, our households,
                        our governments and everything else runs on oil.
                        And if we don't find a way to cut our oil and fossil fuel usage,
                        then it might be too late. Our whole way of living might drag us down
                        the drain.

                        global warming doesn't matter, if things continue as it is, millions will
                        die either way. what do you prefer, drowning, starving or freezing to death?

                        http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...+robert+newman
                        a little ditty that got my thinking

                        Comment

                        • lxskllr
                          Member
                          • Sep 2007
                          • 13435

                          #13
                          How've ya been Stargazer? It's been awhile. Are you still in the army?

                          Comment

                          • Messiah
                            Member
                            • Feb 2009
                            • 87

                            #14
                            The climate change is real. It has happened before. The earth will eventually cleanse itself again. How soon, and if we are helping it along is open for debate in my book.

                            Comment

                            • sgreger1
                              Member
                              • Mar 2009
                              • 9451

                              #15
                              This is another post where I will only post once and keep it short:

                              *Some warming trend is occuring

                              *The impact of humans on this shows some decent evidence, but warming trends do occur naturally.

                              * For us to stop this pollution we would have to live like we did in the 166th century, which no one will do

                              * Not bad enough to where we should stall the economy trying to make everything green

                              *Many companies see this is popular and are eating the cost to make more environmental friendly products = good (and shows how capitalism works because they are doing it to get more business, and the environment benefits)

                              * Wasn't the coming ICE AGE big in the 70's? Not seeing a whole lot of difference between those claims and this.

                              And the one thing we all know: Al Gore sucks, he is profiting off this, he wont debate any scientists not agreeing with him (and there are many), I wish he would just fade away. (But guuuuyyys, i'm super cereal about this....)

                              Comment

                              Working...
                              X