Obamacare

[snupy]

The writer doesn't matter and is obviousely biased towards republicans.

The writer DOES matter. Knowing the author can be a wealth of information as to why an article contains the information that it does.

[sgreger1]

You are obviousely trying to make the statement that if we had basic literacy tests that black people would be too dumb to pass them.

Provide a direct quote and post number where I have ever claimed such or I will consider the above claim retracted due to falsehood.

Dude seriousely your cut and paste responses are starting to get annoying. Do you not recall what you said 5 minutes ago? Re-read your posts and you will see that you keep saying that literary tests are racist and the fact that the people that are calling for them are racist. In the old days, they were racist because blacks couldn't pass them, so I said that if it happened today, are you implying it would still be racist becase black's couldn't pass it? How is having a test of literacy racist, unless you mean to imply that blacks could not pass it.

I have indeed both suggested and implied there is a racial component to these protests. That neither suggests nor implies the motivations of ALL who protest are racism. Why would I suggest something I KNOW I can not prove, because I freely admit I have no way to measure the motivations of ALL who protest?

But we agreed on that like 5 posts ago, yet you keep responding with different things regarding racism and are focusing only on racism in order to take away from the larger concern of growing government. This is what you like to do, take a movement that is protesting big government, finds 5 guys with racist slogans and then in all future references to the movement you just focus on racism. Stop getting all Al Sharpton on us.

The 'n' word, which the use of IS blatant racism, is not politically correct. Black people have been called communists, Marxists and socialists as far back as the civil rights era. We see the same today once a black man ran for the office of president.

ROFL, are you trying to say that protesters just today started calling presidents things like commies and socialists, and they do it now just because of his race? Tea party protesters do not care about being PC, as depicted in their signs. Again, no reason to pretend they are using code words.

I agree, but I refuse to deny the racial component which IS a part of these protests. The party has leaned to the far right, you know, which has ALWAYS been the home of 'white power' and those who believe in and support white supremacy.

Lol, yes, the right has ALWAYS been the white power types, except that republicans freed the slaves, JFK was a republican, and democrats started the KKK but sure, the right has ALWAYS been the racist ones. And again, we already accepted that some are racists in the tea party, yet you won't focus on anything other than that small minority and write the whole movement off because of them.

The majority of those signs are not BLATANTLY racist. They are quoting phrases that black people said on television shows, as if that has anything AT ALL to do with a Harvard educated lawyer. The pictures of monkeys or African witch doctors serve the purpose to downplay his education, and make him appear as either an animal or an uneducated and superstitious African.

Lol, they look pretty racist to me. The word n*gger is even used by the leader of the tea party movement in the picture above.

Now, given the almost instinctual connection made between socialism and redistribution, imagine what many white folks would naturally assume when told that this man, this black man, this black man with an African daddy, was a socialist. Even if those using the term didn't intend it to push racial buttons (and that is a decidedly large "if"), the fact remains that for many, it would almost certainly prompt any number of racial fears and insecurities: as in, the black guy is going to take from those who work and give to those who don't. And naturally, we all know (or at least our ill-informed prejudices tell us) who's in the first group and who's in the second one. Thus, the joke making the rounds on the internet, and likely in your workplace, about Obama planning on taxing aspirin "because it's white and it works." Or the guy with the sign at the April teabagger rally, which read, Obama's Plan: White Slavery. Or others who have carried overtly racist signs to frame their message: signs suggesting that Obama hopes to provide care for all brown-skinned illegal immigrants, while simultaneously murdering the white elderly, or that cast the President in decidely simian imagery, and refer to him, crudely but clearly as a monkey. Or Glenn Beck's paranoid screed from late July, which sought to link health care reform, and virtually every single piece of Obama's political agenda to some kind of backdoor reparations scheme. This, coupled with Beck's even more unhinged claim to have discovered a communist/black nationalist conspiracy in the administration's Green Jobs Initiative. [/url]

Yes the left loves this argument. What's wrong with redistribution of wealth? What you don't want poor black people to get help? Again you throw racism into something that doesn't have to be about racism.

People like earning what they keep, and some of us prefer to not live in a welfare nanny state. If that's racist, than go get my white robe, a cross, and some lighter fluid so i can make the meeting in time.

Oh yeah. It's certainly not easy to understand why a black man in America would EASILY say 'goddamn America,' given the racial history of this country. That's not racist, so much as it reflects the frustrations of living in a society that doesn't view you as equal to others, simply due to the color of your skin.

IT IS NOT THE 1950's ANYMORE. Blacks are equal. Deal with it. And how dare you try and apologize or make excuses for a president that blatantly attends a racist church. "Whites are racist against me, I hate whites so will now be racist against them". <--- that's the line of thinking you want your president to have?? Just because black were oppressed in the past, it's okay for this reverend (and I use the term loosly) to be preaching about taking down america and hating whites? THIS IS WHERE YOU WANT YOU PRESIDENT WORSHIPPING?

Check the incarceration rates of black men as compared to white men if you doubt there is reason for these frustrations to still exist.

I've lived in enough bad neighborhoods to know that these people bring it on themselves. If you kill someone and end up in jail, complaining about how the fact you and all your inmates are minorities and it's all racism doens't cut it with me.

It gives the message that even though you might be a Harvard educated lawyer, not all in this society will view you as legitimate as a white Harvard educated lawyer. Goddamn America indeed. No matter how far you go and no matter how much education you have, in the end, some in our society will still view you as an African witch doctor or a monkey eating a banana. I totally understand what that black preacher was saying and why he said what he said, even though I am white.

That will never change, racism and the tendency to not like others who are different is in our DNA and some will always be this way.

But furthermore, WE HAVE BLACKS IN CONGRESS, ON THE SUPREME COURT, AND A BLACK PRESIDENT. GIVE IT UP DUDE< OPPRESSION IS NOT HAPPENING LIKE IT WAS IN THE 30'S. Stop with the "oh they'r so oppressed".

Was McCain pictured as a monkey? Was Sarah Palin depicted as an African Witch Doctor? I wonder why they weren't?

I'm sure they were, and I know Bush was on numerous occasions. Mccain was portrayed as an old rich white man (racist), Sarah Palin has been prtrayed as every type of bad thing a woman could be (sexist).

It comes with the territory. I will not shed one tear for our poor oppresssed president with his harvard education and job as LEADER OF THE FREE WORLD. Oh, the oppression, oh the horror, the horror!

[sgreger1]

Whew, for about 20 minutes there I was worried you guys had decided to get back to work. Keep it up, this thread is all that is standing between me and absolute boredom! 2 more hours please... thanks

ROFL. The Obama administration should cut me a check for creating jobs. Or they should send the secret police to snatch me up for wasting everyone's time at work.

Either way.

[snupy]

Do you not recall what you said 5 minutes ago?

I most certainly do. I am asking for evidence to back up what you said. Where is it? If I am so 'obviously' implying what you suggest, then it will be a simple matter for you to provide the direct quote and post to prove it.

In the old days, they were racist because blacks couldn't pass them, so I said that if it happened today, are you implying it would still be racist becase black's couldn't pass it?

And I am saying, provide the direct quote and post number where I have ever implied such and I will be more than happy to address it.

Don't you get it yet? Anytime you type 'are you implying....' stop and ask yourself if you actually read what I wrote, or are you attributing things to me which I neither said nor implied? I will call you on this every time you do this, until you get tired of doing it.

How is having a test of literacy racist,

Check the history of how they have been used in the past in this country.

unless you mean to imply that blacks could not pass it.

See! There it is! Those are YOUR THOUGHTS, not mine. I NEVER said ANYTHING like the above in this thread. It is FACT, I stated something totally different and completely unrelated to the above.

WHAT IF I MEAN TO IMPLY PASSING A LITERACY TEST IN ORDER TO VOTE IS BLATANTLY UNCONSTITUTIONAL?

Isn't that EXACTLY what I implied here:

I think the need to pass a test of some type before being eligible to vote is very good idea today.

My response: Good luck in tossing out the Constitution to get your wish.

But we agreed on that like 5 posts ago, yet you keep responding with different things regarding racism and are focusing only on racism in order to take away from the larger concern of growing government.

Uh no. At certain points throughout this discussion, you DIDN'T agree there was a racist component to these protests:

We have protested presidents for years. What about people who protested against vietnam?

Then you tried to claim my argument was that ALL protests against this were based on racism, which never was my point:

just because people oppose the current president (who happens to be black), I don't see how you could draw the conclusion that protesting must = racism.

This is what you like to do, take a movement that is protesting big government, finds 5 guys with racist slogans and then in all future references to the movement you just focus on racism. Stop getting all Al Sharpton on us.

You were the one who originally denied there was ANY racial component to these protests and tried to pass it off as no different than protesting the Viet Nam war, even though none suggested literacy tests for voting and none were depicted as African witch doctors or monkeys when protesting the Viet Nam war. After the racial compenent of some who protest were put in your face in a way you couldn't deny, you then tried to pretend I had argued ALL protests were from a racial component, when I never said, nor implied, any such thing.

ROFL, are you trying to say that protesters just today started calling presidents things like commies and socialists, and they do it now just because of his race? Tea party protesters do not care about being PC, as depicted in their signs. Again, no reason to pretend they are using code words.

And I am sure since past presidents might have been depicted as monkeys means the fact Obama was could not possibly imply any racist motivation on the part of the illustrator.

Lol, yes, the right has ALWAYS been the white power types, except that republicans freed the slaves, JFK was a republican, and democrats started the KKK but sure, the right has ALWAYS been the racist ones.

Why would the white separatists, who hate homos, lie in bed with the Dems, who loves us homos?

And again, we already accepted that some are racists in the tea party,

You didn't accept it. You denied. Once I posted evidence to counter your denial, you next accused me of going 'Al Sharpton' on you.

yet you won't focus on anything other than that small minority and write the whole movement off because of them.

I will leave as an exercise for the readers to determine if I did what you claim:

I DON'T believe those against this for purely political reasons are villainous.

Lol, they look pretty racist to me. The word n*gger is even used by the leader of the tea party movement in the picture above.

Yet there was only one sign that contained that word. The majority were no where near that blatant.

What's wrong with redistribution of wealth?

Nothing obviously, as long as it is redistributed to corporations and aristocrats. Bush redistributed quite a bit that way in his tenure, and no one complained so much as a peep.

What you don't want poor black people to get help? Again you throw racism into something that doesn't have to be about racism.

That's not an argument against redistribution. What is social security, medicare, paying cops, fireman, libraries, court system, all of this is redistribtution of wealth and you never hear so much as a peep about how horrible it is, until the black man gets elected.

People like earning what they keep, and some of us prefer to not live in a welfare nanny state.

Why would one expect a welfare nanny state simply because Obama is president? What is it about Obama that would lead one to expect a nanny welfare state, I wonder?

Blacks are equal. Deal with it.

PROOF?

And how dare you try and apologize or make excuses for a president that blatantly attends a racist church.

A Harvard educated constitutional lawyer is depicted as both a monkey and an African witch doctor in a presidential campaign, yet you still can not understand why black anger against America still exists? Are you that blind?

"Whites are racist against me, I hate whites so will now be racist against them". <--- that's the line of thinking you want your president to have??

What proof do you have that's what Obama thinks? What would lead you to believe those thoughts would go through Obama's mind? You just proved my point. You dont' know what goes through Obama's mind, but you just told me what goes through yours regarding your own fears.

Just because black were oppressed in the past, it's okay for this reverend (and I use the term loosly) to be preaching about taking down america and hating whites? THIS IS WHERE YOU WANT YOU PRESIDENT WORSHIPPING?

It is VERY scary to have a black man in power, isn't it? I mean who knows? What if the black man retaliates against us whites for our past treatment of him?

I've lived in enough bad neighborhoods

Define 'bad neighborhood.' Who lives in that neighborhood?

But furthermore, WE HAVE BLACKS IN CONGRESS, ON THE SUPREME COURT, AND A BLACK PRESIDENT. GIVE IT UP DUDE

We have a black president for the first time in the nation's history. And people have lost their minds.

< OPPRESSION IS NOT HAPPENING LIKE IT WAS IN THE 30'S. Stop with the "oh they'r so oppressed".

Yeah, I don't guess it would be fair to call a black man being dragged to death from the back of a vehicle a 'lynching' like the KKK might do in the 30s.Nope, there's no more oppression at ALL here in the American dream.

I'm sure they were,

Good! Let's see some pics! I posted mine to back up my claims. Where's yours?

Mccain was portrayed as an old rich white man (racist), Sarah Palin has been prtrayed as every type of bad thing a woman could be (sexist).

Old Spice and Bible Spice.

[texasmade]

mccain is a rich old white man though...

[Bigblue1]

I will say no more. EXCEPt THAT:

Arguing on the Internet is like competing in the Special Olympics. Even if you win, you're still retarded.

And I'm sticking to it. ThisThread/ULTIMATE FAIL

[Roo]

This thread is a clear winner as far as I'm concerned, it carried me through a very slow and brutally hungover workday.

[sgreger1]

OMFG> FJKASHJKLFHDKJLAEHJEKLHFGJLHOHJWHBJBVDSFIUHGIUHSW

I just spent an entire hour responding to your last post snupy and it prompted me for my login after I hit submit and deleted my whole freaking post.


Long story short:


*I for months have acknowledged that there are racists in the tea parties. Evidence of that is everywhere on the forum. I always maintain that most people are just protesting big gov, but racists and republicans have tried to hijack the movement.

*You defending Obama's racist pastor by saying his racism is justified due to black oppression in the past, is wrong. Racism is not okay, ever, and it is never justifiable under any circumstance. For you to say racism against whites is justifiable literally just set our country back 100 years. Obama attended a racist church for 20 years, FACT, he must have liked what he heard or he would have gone elsewhere. You lost this debate when you tried to justify racism by saying it's okay because blacks were treated bad in the past, therefore they have a reason to be racist. Racism is never cool.

*For you to claim America has lost its head because we have our first black president is unfounded, as Obama got elected by the majority of Americans, so obviously not as many racists as you thought.

* We both agree racists exist in the world but finding 100 pictures of racist protest signs doesn't mean shit considering we are a nation of nearly 400 million people.

*Blacks are CEO's, congressmen, secretaries of state, presidents, supreme court justices, they have the right to vote and it is illegal (and enforced) to perform a hate crime against black people. Please tell me what more proof you need that blacks are equal.

*You posted a link to some racist killing a black person. While that is a terrible event, black people kill white people too. If you would like proof of this, go to your local ghetto dressed like a white businessman, you will see that racism exists on both sides cracka! Just because there is a few racist things happening does not mean the majority of black people are oppressed, or even a large amount. Our black executives at my work sure don't look too oppressed when they roll up in their Lexus'.

*You found one link of a black person being killed by a white guy for racist reasons. I would post some instances of black people killing others but there is not enough room on the entire internet, let alone this thread.




Not even sure how it got this far but let's just drop it. We both agree racists exist but that they are the minority so there is nothing really left to discuss. Back to the health care legislation if we could please.

[sgreger1]

This thread is a clear winner as far as I'm concerned, it carried me through a very slow and brutally hungover workday.

Yah I got nothing done at work today lol. I was pretty hungover too.

[wa3zrm]

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[sgreger1]

lolol. The hitler find out that X happened videos never get old for me. Such a stunning performance for whatever actor played hitler in this one.

[sgreger1]

Heyif anyone wants to hear pro-lifers threaten Stupak on his home phone, check this video out. One guy they had to bleep out for like a minute lol.

http://www.cbsnews.com/video/watch/?...nt;cbsCarousel


And i'll just leave this here for nostalgia:

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Also, for those who think this bill will be taken down in court, bad news.

http://open.salon.com/blog/paul_j_or...-212_years_ago

There is nothing illegal or unconstitutional about the mandate and it has been done before, by John Adams in 1798.

[tom502]

I agree with sgreger1.

[tom502]

Obama's extremist pal declares 'socialism has a future'
Cornel West urges help for 'dear friend' at 'crucial historical moment'

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Posted: March 25, 2010
2:57 pm Eastern

By Aaron Klein
© 2010 WorldNetDaily

A personal friend and recent adviser to President Obama addressed a socialist conference at which he declared "socialism has a future" while urging participants to help Obama.

Cornel West, an extremist race-relations instructor at Princeton, addressed the 10th annual Young Democratic Socialists conference earlier this month. The three-day event took place at Norman Thomas High School in Manhattan, named after an American socialist activist.

The meeting, entitled "Real change for a change," described itself as a "snap shot of the current socialist movement in the United States."

During a lengthy address available on YouTube, West declared "socialism has a future."

He stated, "We are at a very crucial historical moment. My dear friend Barack Obama, he needs help. He needs deep help. He needs pressure. Organized, mobilized pressure."

West went on to urge the crowd not to rely on "messiahs" or "leaders," instead explaining the mantel for ushering socialist change into the country "falls onto us."

Obama named West, whom he has called a personal friend, to the Black Advisory Council of his presidential campaign. West was a key point man between Obama's campaign and the black community.

West served as an adviser on Louis Farrakhan's Million Man March and is a self-described personal friend of the Nation of Islam leader. West authored two books on race with Harvard professor Henry Louis Gates Jr, who was at the center of a recent controversy in which Obama criticized Gates' treatment by police outside his home after a report of a burglary.

'Racist American empire'

It was West who introduced Obama at a 2007 Harlem fundraiser attended by about 1,500 people that served as Obama's first foray into Harlem after announcing his Democratic presidential candidacy.

WND reported West introduced Obama on stage at the fundraiser after first railing against the "racist" criminal-justice system of the "American empire."

A scan of YouTube clips found West introducing Obama at the fundraiser while stating the "American empire is in such a deep crisis" and slamming the "racist criminal-justice system" and "disgraceful schools in our city."

"He is my brother and my companion and comrade," said West of Obama.

WND found a video that shows Obama taking the stage just after West's introduction, expressing his gratitude to West, calling him "not only a genius, a public intellectual, a preacher, an oracle ... he's also a loving person."

Obama asked the audience for a round of applause for West.

From a young age, West proclaimed he admired "the sincere black militancy of Malcolm X, the defiant rage of the Black Panther Party … and the livid black (liberation) theology of James Cone."

Cone's theology spawned Rev. Jeremiah Wright, Obama's controversial pastor for 20 years at the Trinity United Church of Christ. West was a strong defender of Wright when the pastor's extreme remarks became national news during the presidential campaign.

In 1995, West signed a letter published as an ad in the New York Times that voiced support for cop-killer Mumia Abu-Jamal, a former Black Panther.

In 2002, West further signed a "Statement of Conscience" crafted by Not In Our Name, a project of C. Clark Kissinger's Revolutionary Communist Party. He then endorsed the World Can't Wait campaign, a Revolutionary Communist Party project seeking to organize "people living in the United States to take responsibility to stop the whole disastrous course led by the Bush administration."

After branding the U.S. a "racist patriarchal" nation in his book "Race Matters," West wrote, "White America has been historically weak-willed in ensuring racial justice and has continued to resist fully accepting the humanity of blacks."

Also in that book, West claimed the 9/11 attacks gave white Americans a glimpse of what it means to be a black person in the U.S. – feeling "unsafe, unprotected, subject to random violence and hatred" for who they are.

"Since 9/11," West wrote, "the whole nation has the blues, when before it was just black people."

With additional research by Brenda J. Elliott'

[Veganpunk]

I'm not gonna read through all 10 pages of this thread, I'm sure it's amusing, but none the less, hear are my feelings:

I've always been a crazy non meat eating, left wing, punk rock liberal. I voted for Obama because hell, we just spent 8 years under stupidity. This health care is not universal. All this does is make middle class working citizens pay more, and hate more, universal health care. If they were to do it correctly like other countries, people wouldn't mind paying higher taxes. Now we're gonna pay more and not get shit. I think I'm just gonna skip the vote booth next time.