Polish President died in plane crash.

[scylla]

Well I don't see Poland as being anything but firmly in America's corner no matter who is president.
We have a huge Polish immigrant population here in the midwest and I deal with them on a daily basis. These guys are hardcore entrepreneurs and the salt of the earth.
I can see them becoming a real regional economic and political power here, which will only strengthen our two countries ties.

[Mazur]

Muzur, what kind of government does Poland have? I am not too familiar with it. From what I gather they are still torn between communism and a more western approach, and the current president was anti-communism.

It is a bit complicated. President was anti-communism and he prefered more independency for Poland. Goverment (PO) do not care about independency and comply with EU policy, which is socialistic and more and more resemble former Soviet Union policy (I mean economy, a lot of burocracy, regulations, central EU goverment with lot of power, and not putting oposition into jail).
President was social conservative, goverment is social-liberal (something like democrats in US).
Goverment also protect businesses of former comunists and do not want to shame and blame people that was stool pigeons in communism time.
President wanted to reveal all collaborators from commnism times, like Germans did with Stasi, like Swedish did with their quislings after WWII.

And i'm interested in what you said about the "authority" thing. Did the passengers demand the pilot to land even though conditions were bad? That's what it sounds like, they put the pilot under pressure to "make it happen" and land the damn thing on time and so the pilot missed his mark and now they are blaming it on "pilot error".

It is possible that pilot was under pressure. The capitan of aircraft is God at his plane and no one can order him. But a few months ago on another flight there was quarrel between pilot and President concerning landing in dengerous area of Georgia at war.
And now on a plane was also all highest general so he could feel some presure.
This is also unofficial russian explanation.
But we do not know for sure yet.

[Mazur]

Re: Kacynski's death

Mazur, I grieve with you and all of Poland for the loss of President Kacynski, his wife, Maria, and all who were aboard for such a sacred visit.

I am in Russia now, and most here are in shock as well, especially considering that PMs Tusk and Putin had just met in Katyn' for the first of many steps to reconciliation for the brutalities which took place there. I lived several years in Poland, and I'm just wrecked by this.

One thing they are showing is that the Captain of the plane had approved its recent upgrade at the TU factory in Samara (where Polish Air Force 2 is under renovation currently). It has contemporary western avionics, and its physical condition may not end up being a factor. It was a decision made against the orders of the control tower to land in Minsk or Moscow.

Let's hope the strong faith of all on board gave them comfort in the last moments.

thanks

we all waiting for official explanations

[sgreger1]

Muzur, what kind of government does Poland have? I am not too familiar with it. From what I gather they are still torn between communism and a more western approach, and the current president was anti-communism.

It is a bit complicated. President was anti-communism and he prefered more independency for Poland. Goverment (PO) do not care about independency and comply with EU policy, which is socialistic and more and more resemble former Soviet Union policy (I mean economy, a lot of burocracy, regulations, central EU goverment with lot of power, and not putting oposition into jail).
President was social conservative, goverment is social-liberal (something like democrats in US).
Goverment also protect businesses of former comunists and do not want to shame and blame people that was stool pigeons in communism time.
President wanted to reveal all collaborators from commnism times, like Germans did with Stasi, like Swedish did with their quislings after WWII.

Than this is a sad day indeed comrade. The world gets smaller the more I learn, Poland struggles with the same thing we do here in the states. Hopefully the new administration is equally as kind to the US as the last one was, and hopefully they will look at this event and think about updating whatever plane they send the next president on.

I just can't help but feel that it is rather convenient for these particular people to have died on the craft during this time. I am sure the opposition is rejoicing. Here in America however, we morn the fall of a good ally.

But f*ck it, this is why all cultures enjoy beer, if there was ever any evidence for a God, the 40 at your local liquor store is that evidence. 8)

[sagedil]

I just wanted to say to my friends here in Poland AND Russia just how deeply sorry I am for your loss. On top of WHY he was traveling, and now the connection with that horrible moment in your history, is just almost too much, and my souls grieves for the pain and shock you are all experiencing.

But also know this. Y'all are about as tough as they come, you have survived SO much I know your entire country will come and work together to get through this

[sgreger1]

Air traffic control told the pilot of Mr. Kaczynski’s plane to turn back because it was too dangerous to land in Tbilisi, but President Kaczynski — who also is commander-in-chief under Polish law — ordered the pilot to land anyway.

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/...rticle1530087/