Aid ship attacked by Israeli soldiers

[Judge Faust]

Isn't running a blockade considered an act of war?

By this I mean "blockade-running". Obviously establishing a blockade is.

"Act of war" is a meaningless term as far as international law goes. There is no consensus for what constitutes an act of war, and nations simply throw it around for propaganda purposes. As an example, look at North and South Korea; hardly a month goes by without them accusing each other of at least one act of war.

Basically, acts of war aren't mentioned by international law, which focuses on war crimes instead. For these, we would fall back to the Geneva Conventions and the Rome Statute. To make a long story short, running a blockade is not a war crime - killing innocent civilians on purpose is. Don't expect any prosecutions, though. The US will continue to block any such attempts through the Security Council, and the International Criminal Court is an intensely political organization which has apparently decided to focus solely on sub-Saharan Africa.

[danielan]

For these, we would fall back to the Geneva Conventions and the Rome Statute. To make a long story short, running a blockade is not a war crime - killing innocent civilians on purpose is. Don't expect any prosecutions, though. The US will continue to block any such attempts through the Security Council, and the International Criminal Court is an intensely political organization which has apparently decided to focus solely on sub-Saharan Africa.

Are civilian blockade-runners considered unprivileged combatants? unlawful combatants?

There seems to be a long established tradition that it is ok to attack ships, civilian or military, trying to run blockades. That's more or less how blockades work. (And we have been on both sides of this - we cry when it happens to us too, but it doesn't make us more right (i.e., the Lusitania was basically running a blockade, etc.))

"Innocent civilians" seems like a stretch in this case.

[tom502]

Intellectual debate on certain aspects concerning the H event, should be open to debate, yet it is not. It also shows the immense power the Israeli world lobby has, to have people imprisoned for surfacing questions that may not correspond with the zionist approved history.

[sgreger1]

While most stories will have multiple versions, there is no rational reason to see them as being equally credible. Example: Holocaust-denial is one "telling" of WWII. It is not credible, and need not be given much consideration in the course of intellectual debate.

In support of my position, I point to Israel's 60-year history of excessive violence, unrestrained willingness to massacre civilians, and complete and utter disregard for human rights norms. I point at Turkey's opposite stances in these regards, as well as its incessant efforts to resolve the Zionist issue through non-violent means. I point to the fact that heavily-armed Israeli troops boarded civilian ships in international waters. I could point to a lot of mutually-accepted facts; the point being that history supports my position, rather than the fairy-tale world of the Zionist regime.

Also, I note that, even as you admonish me for taking sides, you too have clearly taken a side - the Zionist one. Look back at the post I quoted - like Frosted, you advance Israel's version of events as truth. As such, you are no more unbiased then I am; your biased position simply lacks any grounding in our apparent reality.

First of all, if you read half of my posts you will see that I think Israel was in the wrong here, so not sure where your coming from. I'm just saying lets take a deeper look at why Israel acts the way it does, it's not like everyone is trying to be their friend and they are just trying to be bullies.


In support of my position, I point toPALESTINES 60-year history of excessive violence, unrestrained willingness to massacre civilians, and complete and utter disregard for human rights norms. See how that works? Both sides are involved in killing civilians, utter disregard for human rights or the geneva conventions. Why is the Israeli civilians life worth less to you than the Palestinian? This is what I am saying, you have two groups of bad people doing bad things to each other, so why consistently only single out 1 of them and blame it all on them. Both sides share blame in almost all of these conflicts.

As for this particular incident, Israel has yet again shot itself in the foot by possible farking up relations with their only muslim ally in the region, turkey. But hey, they will reap what they sow.

[danielan]

As for this particular incident, Israel has yet again shot itself in the foot by possible farking up relations with their only muslim ally in the region, turkey. But hey, they will reap what they sow.

Turkey isn't really innocent in this either. They knew that the 600 protesters were going to go run the blockade and they let it not only happen, but under the cover of their flag.

[sgreger1]

Intellectual debate on certain aspects concerning the H event, should be open to debate, yet it is not. It also shows the immense power the Israeli world lobby has, to have people imprisoned for surfacing questions that may not correspond with the zionist approved history.

In America you are free to debate what you please (like we're doign right now for example). In europe it is a crime, which I think is stupid. Free speech is free speech. Why do the jews get to have special treatment because of their holocaust? What of all the countless other "holocausts" that have occured over the years in places like Africa? It is all political and without substance. I feel hitler was immensely evil for what he did, but I don't feel the jews should be honored as heroes or something just because they were convinced to walk into gas chambers knowing what lie ahead.

[sgreger1]

@ JUDGE FAUST:


You are a fan of Lenin, right Judge? Let's see what he had to say about anti-semitism.

Lenin’s opposition to anti-Semitism:

"The Tsarist police, in alliance with the landowners and the capitalists, organized pogroms against the Jews. The landowners and capitalists tried to divert the hatred of the workers and peasants, who were tortured by want, against the Jews. . . . Only the most ignorant and down-trodden people can believe the lies and slander that are spread about the Jews. . . . It is not the Jews who are the enemies of the working people. The enemies of the workers are the capitalists of all countries. Among the Jews there are working people, and they form the majority. They are our brothers, who, like us, are oppressed by capital; they are our comrades in the struggle for socialism. Among the Jews there are kulaks, exploiters, and capitalists, just as there are among the Russians, and among people of all nations . . . Rich Jews, like rich Russians, and the rich in all countries, are in alliance to oppress, crush, rob, and disunite the workers . . . Shame on accursed Tsarism, which tortured and persecuted the Jews. Shame on those who foment hatred towards the Jews, who foment hatred towards other nations."



Not saying that you are in any way being anti-semetic because you do not appear to be taking that stance, but rather you do not seem to see the Jews as brothers and human beings that are entitled to the "human rghts" you so often become a proponent of. When their civilians are killed I hear silence to the point where I could hear a pin drop from the anti-israel crowd.


Listen to your hero Faust, we are all brothers here in the working class, and the rich (be it jew, german, american, or other) oligarchs all conspire against the working class. In this struggle we must find a bond between all the peoples of the world who wish to live in peace and abundance. To defeat this ruling class of oppressors we must stand together and not be distracted by their games.

The anti-jew thing is one of those games i'm afraid, just as the black vs. white, mexican vs. american thing. It's all a ruse, created by the upperclass to keep us fighting amongst ourselves so that we may never unite to take down the real threat to world stability. Don't play into it Faust, do not use the "human rights" thing as a weapon to use against your opponents, yet pardon your own team when they commit the same crimes. Like how you blast American imperialism yet seem to be a proponent of communist imperialism. The rules must be universal and apply to everyone, and we shouldn't use these catchphrases like "human rights" in situations where they are not warranted.

What happened was one of error on both sides, both who were looking for trouble and both who got it. As always, the side that pulled the trigger first gets the bad publicity, but do not think for 1 moment that those protestors didn't come there to do anything but cause trouble that would later be reported in the media.

[AllanH]

Lenin was absolutely wrong about jews and anti-semitism, which was nationalistic in theory and practice in Poland, Lithuania and The Ukraine when they were part of old Russian Empire. There was anti-semitism in Russia proper too but nothing like in western territories.

[LaZeR]

[bsd777]

Great video! Made my day. It's difficult sometimes, feeling surrounded by America and Jew hating malcontents. I guess that's when you turn off the tv, stop reading blogs and go talk to some real Americans. Most, around here, know what time it is.

[bsd777]

Here's a great blast from the past. Never forget who your friends are.

[LaZeR]

Here's a great blast from the past. Never forget who your friends are.

...video snipped cause it makes me puke....

Exactly!

[truthwolf1]

[truthwolf1]

Yup, never forget who your friends are.

[danielan]

Yup, never forget who your friends are.

Everyone spies on everyone. In fact, the USS Liberty was a US spy ship. I mean..."Technical Research" vessel.