The American Middle Class is Rapidly Disappearing

[texastorm]

Unions have there place in this world, and in a perfect world we would have never needed them, unfortunately once the union gains some power it to becomes as corrupt as mr evil stockholder.

If we put all the money in a big pile and divvy it up equally and start over it would only be a few months before the classes started forming again. Those who know how to get the money from those who don't know how to keep it will win. Thats just life, and I get so tired of hearing people complain about it. Either learn how to get yours or stfu. I bet in the caveman days the best hunters got the best women. I bet the weak hunters sat in a circle around the fire griped about the chief and how he took the whole bison skin for himself! (assuming they weren't vegetarians, in which case subsitute nasty berry of your choice)

We are becoming a nation of pussies. Whaaaa I want life to be fair... boo hoo.

[Curtisp]

These anti-union zealots always circle back to the UAW and GM, Ford etc. I find it funny, that american car companies were able to pay these inflated salaries, all whilst producing an inferior product, and screwing the public with their crappy cars for years. Then, WE allow foreign companies to sell/ build here, and they are able to build a high quality product for less money. Hmm, when you have a "captive" audience for your goods, i guess it's ok to screw the piss out of them. Then, when things get tough, you blame the price of your union labors contract (which, you agreed to obviously, that's why it's a contract) and go to Washington, on your private jet and ask for a f"n bailout! I was union for years, and i have plenty of issues with them for sure, but i now live in a "right to work" state, which believe me is a euphemism to screw middle class workers out of a "living wage"! Just figure out a way to pay workers what they need to make to buy products made HERE! stop making shit outside of our borders, because third worlders will work for pennies, they have TO! That's why they live there and not here. Parisians pay five bucks for a cup of coffee, because their pay keeps up with their level of inflation and cost of living increases. Read the statistics, Americans are making less now, work more hours, take less vacation than they did 30 years ago. A two class system is only good for one class! Guess which one??

[Bigblue1]

I am by no means an anti-union zealot. My father was a union man till he died. But that does not mean I buy into every union ever. Unions at this point aren't about the worker, they like everything else are exploitable and have been exploited. I was conveying my personal experience within the industry that is all. Just saying....

[sgreger1]

These anti-union zealots always circle back to the UAW and GM, Ford etc. I find it funny, that american car companies were able to pay these inflated salaries, all whilst producing an inferior product, and screwing the public with their crappy cars for years. Then, WE allow foreign companies to sell/ build here, and they are able to build a high quality product for less money. Hmm, when you have a "captive" audience for your goods, i guess it's ok to screw the piss out of them. Then, when things get tough, you blame the price of your union labors contract (which, you agreed to obviously, that's why it's a contract) and go to Washington, on your private jet and ask for a f"n bailout! I was union for years, and i have plenty of issues with them for sure, but i now live in a "right to work" state, which believe me is a euphemism to screw middle class workers out of a "living wage"! Just figure out a way to pay workers what they need to make to buy products made HERE! stop making shit outside of our borders, because third worlders will work for pennies, they have TO! That's why they live there and not here. Parisians pay five bucks for a cup of coffee, because their pay keeps up with their level of inflation and cost of living increases. Read the statistics, Americans are making less now, work more hours, take less vacation than they did 30 years ago. A two class system is only good for one class! Guess which one??

You mean like this? Bailed-Out Banks Awarded $1.6 Billion in Executive Bonuses

[Curtisp]

"Exactly. This is in essence my problem. When the economy suffers and everyone is loosing their jobs and suffering from lower wages, unions and government employees expect to keep their good compensation packages. This means we cannot be competitive in the broader world market, because when things slow down, others in other countries will do it for less. "


Every union and labor org. in this country is making concessions, re-contracting, etc. to keep their company(s) afloat right now. What they are not willing to DO is go backwards to being NON- UNION again, which is really what big business wants, because then they can go back to doing what they did, which created unions in the first place! Go read the stats on China, the workers there are asking for raises, talking union, etc, try and guess why? Because when you work your ass off, and don't get anywhere/thing it hurts. That's the same crap that happened here a 100 years ago, which is why there are unions to begin with.

[sgreger1]

"Exactly. This is in essence my problem. When the economy suffers and everyone is loosing their jobs and suffering from lower wages, unions and government employees expect to keep their good compensation packages. This means we cannot be competitive in the broader world market, because when things slow down, others in other countries will do it for less. "



Every union and labor org. in this country is making concessions, re-contracting, etc. to keep their company(s) afloat right now. What they are not willing to DO is go backwards to being NON- UNION again, which is really what big business wants, because then they can go back to doing what they did, which created unions in the first place! Go read the stats on China, the workers there are asking for raises, talking union, etc, try and guess why? Because when you work your ass off, and don't get anywhere/thing it hurts. That's the same crap that happened here a 100 years ago, which is why there are unions to begin with.

The real solution here, though unrealistic, is to launch campaigns to try and make all of our competitor's workforce unionize. Then it would be a more equal playing field because they wouldnt be able to pay slave wages.

[GoVegan]

You mean like this? Bailed-Out Banks Awarded $1.6 Billion in Executive Bonuses

I am not sure on how to do the math here but I am fairly certain that you could support a lot of jobs, even $80.00 an hour jobs , with 1.6 billion dollars. You have to look long and hard to find workers, even union ones, making anywhere near $80.00 an hour but I could get a list of thousands of CEOS making millions if not tens of millions annually. I would just love to see an 70% tax rate on anybody making a million plus a year. That way, a company would be much better off reinvesting it's profits instead of paying some CEO's fat salary. This was also one of my major issues with Obama working with the insurance companies to create a health care plan. It is not unheard of for an insurance CEO or board member to make 7-15 million per year. How many families will need to buy health insurance at $1000 bucks a month just to pay their salaries? The problem is not the poor or middle class. It is the wealthy in this country that want us to all work for $1.00 a day.

[GoVegan]

The real solution here, though unrealistic, is to launch campaigns to try and make all of our competitor's workforce unionize. Then it would be a more equal playing field because they wouldnt be able to pay slave wages.

Good idea. I also think that our country should not allow products to enter this country that do not come from a manufacturer that does not pay at least a living wage according to the standards of that country.

[Curtisp]

Originally Posted by sgreger1
The real solution here, though unrealistic, is to launch campaigns to try and make all of our competitor's workforce unionize. Then it would be a more equal playing field because they wouldnt be able to pay slave wages.


Great idea in theory, however we aren't having much success as of late taking our ideology to other countries, ie, iraq, afghanistan etc. Let's fix our own problems here first, then we can lead by example.

[Bigblue1]

Good idea. I also think that our country should not allow products to enter this country that do not come from a manufacturer that does not pay at least a living wage according to the standards of that country.

Once again my friend, that would not be in the interest of the elites

[sgreger1]

Originally Posted by sgreger1
The real solution here, though unrealistic, is to launch campaigns to try and make all of our competitor's workforce unionize. Then it would be a more equal playing field because they wouldnt be able to pay slave wages.


Great idea in theory, however we aren't having much success as of late taking our ideology to other countries, ie, iraq, afghanistan etc. Let's fix our own problems here first, then we can lead by example.

And that leads us to the real problem my friend. The US has advanced too far past the rest of the world. It cannot be stable no matter what. Our lifestyle will continue to get more expensive, and our jobs will slowly be lost to those overseas who will do it cheaper. Theres almost no way to stop it.

Eventually americans wont be able to pay for their expensive houses and new cars, which is exactly what has happened. And now were stuck with an inflated economy where prices are super high but wages are super low. We are going to gp through several years of massive deflation in this country. Normally this would be bad for big business and banks, but the government will just keep bailing them out so they can live to screw us another day.


The fact no one is in jail for this whole financialcollapsethenbailout boondoggle amazes me.

[Curtisp]

True, true, man. Living with/ on less is not something we are very good at. But on the bright side 2012 is coming, so let's just have a party and say f*** it!

[sgreger1]

True, true, man. Living with/ on less is not something we are very good at. But on the bright side 2012 is coming, so let's just have a party and say f*** it!

Its funny how the commies over in china are more capitalists than we are. For example, while i was wasting my life in the holocaust denial thread, china was working around the clock to design a robot targeted directly at the snuson demographic:







It has opensource software and learns over time. This means i can teach it to bring me snus. Face it, the reds have won!

[Curtisp]

Its funny how the commies over in china are more capitalists than we are. For example, while i was wasting my life in the holocaust denial thread, china was working around the clock to design a robot targeted directly at the snuson demographic:







It has opensource software and learns over time. This means i can teach it to bring me snus. Face it, the reds have won!

Pal, if that version can learn to bring me a tin of thunder frosted long+, i'll go commie tomorrow!

[sgreger1]

Pal, if that version can learn to bring me a tin of thunder frosted long+, i'll go commie tomorrow!

Im with you bro. Im trying to commit some industrial espionage so i can trade them my info for one of these bots.