Why do people believe in conspiracy theories, or why does Tom exist...

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  • sgreger1
    Member
    • Mar 2009
    • 9451

    Originally posted by MGX View Post
    I'm none too sure.
    Originally posted by MGX View Post

    None I know believe in any of this stuff. It's honest curiosity.

    So what chemicals are in these chemtrails? Are they not water vapor as shown on a thermodynamic (P/V Saturated Vapor Pressure Dome) chart?





    Lol. So here's the theory on chemtrails.

    A) I'm not stupid, I know damn well what a contrail is. I controlled various types of aircraft as a forward observer in the army and have jumped out of airplanes more times than I can count. I am very familiar with how heated air/condensation crystallizes in the cool high-altitude air and forms a vapor trail (contrail) that persists for approximately a mile behind the craft depending on it's speed and engine type.
    B) This is not what chemtrails are.

    I noticed them first when I was living in LA. The contrails (what I thought were contrails), would last for hours a few short minutes, while some contrails would last for hours. Not only would they last, but they would expand and turn into giant clouds, as though they were sucking up moisture from their surrounding area. I thought it was interesting that one type of contrail was acting in such a radically different manner than the others surrounding it, so got into photographing it and taking time-lapse video of it.

    I looked it up online and it turns out others noticed this too, and there was a whole movement behind it. Communities getting sick, chemists finding extremely high quantities of barium and aluminum in the water on heavy spray days. The emergence of a new disease that causes these moving worm-type structures to form under your skin (Morgellon's disease I believe it is). I read a chemists analysis of it from some guy who apparently had been collecting samples and photographing them under a microscope since the 90's.

    Then I found all the other pictures and people, particularly in smaller areas, which show regular airlines going about their day, then every once in a while a (seemingly) military aircraft would come along and spray criss cross patters in the sky, forming a grid or sometimes other shapes.


    Anyways, the theory that SOME have is that these trails are being used as conductive material that when used together with an antenna array like HAARP, can be used for some nefarious purpose. The military has a lot of papers on how they planned to use chemicals mixed in with jet fuel to create chemtrails, which could then be used as deployable antennas to increase the effective communication range for military personnel etc, but this happens on such a mass scale it couldn't possibly be that. Some assume it is for weather control, as the government published a number of studies that discussed the ability for a facility like HAARP used in conjunction with barium oxide chemtrails to heat the ionosphere and manipulate the weather.


    The US congress tried passing a bill at least 3-5 times in the late 90's that would ban the use of "exotic weapons systems" and specifically named chemtrails as one of the items they wanted banned. It was part of the "don't weaponize space" fervor that was going on at the time. The bill was struck down multiple times, until eventually chemtrails was taken out and the bill was passed. So it is recognized by the US congress, which lends some credibility to it I suppose.


    Personally, it was just something I observed, and upon further research it struck millions of other people as odd as well. A lush conspiracy community has grown around it, with most people believing it has to do with some type of weather control. Some believe it is part of something more devious but I doubt it. The whole thing doesn't make sense, how they could get away with it or afford to spray that much chemicals all over the continent. But who knows.

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    • jamesstew
      Member
      • May 2008
      • 1440

      Comment

      • Roo
        Member
        • Jun 2008
        • 3446

        Since when do contrails last only a few miles or minutes and not dissipate? The opposite has been their nature, at least as I've observed them since I was a little kid (well before the 90s). Contrails are long as hell and last a long time, their brightness and duration dependent on the plane's altitude, light conditions, and outside air temperature during flight.

        Comment

        • MGX
          Member
          • Jun 2010
          • 127

          Don't forget humidity and dew point. Being in Seattle I would imagine cooler temperatures and higher water saturation of the air which would lead to longer lasting contrails compared to arid and hot regions.

          It seems a stretch to take air samples and pin down exactly where particulate came from unless it was something like organic CO2 (whose isotope differs from inorganic CO2) in which case it came from combustion.

          Comment

          • sgreger1
            Member
            • Mar 2009
            • 9451

            Originally posted by Roo View Post
            Since when do contrails last only a few miles or minutes and not dissipate? The opposite has been their nature, at least as I've observed them since I was a little kid (well before the 90s). Contrails are long as hell and last a long time, their brightness and duration dependent on the plane's altitude, light conditions, and outside air temperature during flight.

            The length and amount of time a regular contrail stays depends mainly on how cold the air is. In places like Seattle they last much longer than in CA. Here they go away in a manner of minutes usually.

            Their duration is not really what makes the difference, it's the fact that chemtrails will grow into giant clouds and then those clouds will then bend and twist, sometimes in dramatic ways, while the rest of the clouds will stay normal and contrails will persist as usual.




            There is a big difference. I don't know if it's just me misunderstanding something, and it likely is. But to me it looked wierd and apparently it cought the eyes of millions of others across multiple countries. Not that that really means anything.



            Additionally, we know they have the means of doing it. This is a video showing a craft that COULD be equipped to do it. As justin pointed out in our last discussion, this is not a "chemtrail" plain, despite what the guy talking in the background says. I am just posting this to show that it would be easy to rig a plane up to disperse mass amounts of aerosols.


            Comment

            • Roo
              Member
              • Jun 2008
              • 3446

              sgreger: I'm not trying to get into much of a debate, research style, because I prefer to spew off as you know without putting much thought to it... but the (let's call them) cloud formations in that picture you posted look, to the naked eye, (and the naked Roo) to be at vastly different altitudes. Just recently the airlines and air traffic control have finally begun to loosen up and *really* take advantage of jet streams and air currents and various altitudes to save fuel. Not that they didn't used to, but I read up on the airline industry a lot because it's my job, and it's true. A personal example is that in September I flew Qatar Airways from Paris to Kuala Lumpur at a cruising altitude of 46,000 feet. I've been on planes since I was a month old and throughout my early and later years, and never have I flown at that height or even close. Then from Singapore to Chicago the United flight cruised at 26,000 feet transpacific and we landed 30 minutes early. Jet streams baby, they push planes and contort clouds and contrails at varying layers of current (altitude).

              MGX: Good point.

              Comment

              • sgreger1
                Member
                • Mar 2009
                • 9451

                Fair enough roo. I don't really try to convince people of it, its a personal experience that is just something that seemed interesting to me.

                Comment

                • truthwolf1
                  Member
                  • Oct 2008
                  • 2696

                  I think I posted this trailer once before but I look forward to watching it here soon.

                  http://dailypaul.com/node/146357

                  Comment

                  • sgreger1
                    Member
                    • Mar 2009
                    • 9451

                    You guys think i'm crazy? Well check this out:



                    OMFG TOM WAS RIGHT!!!!!!


                    Norad officer predicted aliens would buzz major citie(s) today, and they did (according to some)


                    Fleet of ufos observed by hundreds in manhattan park today. FBI recieves hundreds of calls from people on the ground. Police say it is a baloon, but hundreds of people at the park (where baloons can often be seen) are positive it was an aircraft. It would blink, dissapear, and hover slowly, sometimes stopping.

                    http://www.nydailynews.com/ny_local/...fo_frenzy.html

                    Comment

                    • Bigblue1
                      Banned Users
                      • Dec 2008
                      • 3923

                      Well Tom hasn't posted in awhile, Maybe they heard his prayers and picked him up.

                      Comment

                      • justintempler
                        Member
                        • Nov 2008
                        • 3090

                        Originally posted by Bigblue1 View Post
                        Well Tom hasn't posted in awhile, Maybe they heard his prayers and picked him up.
                        or maybe he just got drunk and passed out?

                        Comment

                        • tom502
                          Member
                          • Feb 2009
                          • 8985

                          I posted till I got off work yesterday, and back at work now and posting again.

                          I wish they'd abduct me, I even keep some ky in my pocket just in case.

                          Seriously though, I'm trying to figure out what happened in NY. I keep missing the news on TV. And I am hearing that it might be balloons, yet then, I am hearing(or reading) that it is not. Like self-controlled orbs that did not act in a balloon riding on the wind.

                          So, right now, I just don't know. Of course I hope it's not just balloons, but I just don't know. And if it's not, I hope there is more to come, because I wanna see something BIG. I don't wanna just believe, I wanna KNOW.

                          Comment

                          • jamesstew
                            Member
                            • May 2008
                            • 1440

                            Originally posted by tom502 View Post
                            I posted till I got off work yesterday, and back at work now and posting again.

                            I wish they'd abduct me, I even keep some ky in my pocket just in case.

                            Seriously though, I'm trying to figure out what happened in NY. I keep missing the news on TV. And I am hearing that it might be balloons, yet then, I am hearing(or reading) that it is not. Like self-controlled orbs that did not act in a balloon riding on the wind.

                            So, right now, I just don't know. Of course I hope it's not just balloons, but I just don't know. And if it's not, I hope there is more to come, because I wanna see something BIG. I don't wanna just believe, I wanna KNOW.
                            Methinks you need a new girlfriend to explore.

                            Comment

                            • jamesstew
                              Member
                              • May 2008
                              • 1440

                              Aliens don't real!!!!!

                              Comment

                              • truthwolf1
                                Member
                                • Oct 2008
                                • 2696

                                I have seen hundreds of these type of pictures since I can remember with 3,4,5 all in a similar geometric pattern.

                                Dont know much about weather balloons but are they setup similar in almost a pattern like appearance?

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