Public health sceptical about snus - targetting kids?

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  • darkwing
    Member
    • Oct 2007
    • 415

    Public health sceptical about snus - targetting kids?

    Note the line about "nicotine addicts unable to live to their full potential!:

    From snusnews:

    Saturday, February 28, 2009
    U.S. group acknowledged that smokeless-tobacco products are an option for reducing health risks for tobacco users..

    February 28, 2009 - Twenty-six of the United States' leading tobacco control researchers and policy experts have called for regulatory control of all tobacco products. They also called for policies that encourage current tobacco users to reduce their health risks by switching from the most to the least harmful nicotine-containing products.

    This group met in a two-year process they called The Strategic Dialogue on Tobacco Harm Reduction - members met four times between December 2005 and August 2007.
    Their vision: a world in which virtually no one uses cigarettes. But the group acknowledged that smokeless-tobacco products are an option for reducing health risks for tobacco users. They also called for policies that encourage current tobacco users to reduce their health risks by switching from the most to the least harmful nicotine-containing products.

    PAPER: Mitch Zeller et al., The strategic dialogue on tobacco harm reduction: A vision and blueprint for action in the United States, Tob Control 2009 0: 200802731, ABSTRACT..

    We’re all for this safer alternative if distribution could be limited to inveterate tobacco smokers (smokers who are either unable or unwilling to quit). The harm reduction component envisioned by the American Association of Public Health Physicians would be part of a larger program, with "marketing" limited to satisfying the nicotine addiction of inveterate smokers at substantially less health risk than smoking.

    Let's be realistic it would be impossible to limit distribution of smokeless tobacco products to inveterate tobacco smokers. As Professor John Britton, Chairman of the Royal College of Physicians Tobacco Advisory Group, a proponent of harm reduction solution has concluded, “It’s their (tobacco companies) job to sell as much tobacco as possible, so they will be targeting non-smokers rather than current ones, that’s the worry.”

    Dr. Britton is correct in that tobacco companies have an entirely different goal in mind – they are already targeting a much younger crowd of young adults and any kids they can entice along the way - witness the tagline for Camel SNUS: "Pleasure for wherever." Or how about the ads that have be run in local papers where Camel SNUS was being test marketed. Smokeless tobacco manufacturers are very disappointed with the progress of the SNUS segment in total. The entire segment itself has gained very little traction, and we had plans to be more aggressive.

    "There is no evidence smokeless tobacco can help people quit smoking. There are no studies we would consider sufficient." Dr. Terry Pechacek, Associate Director of Science at the Centers for Disease Control Office on Smoking and Health. (SNUS the BUMP, Nordic Reach (The Scandinavian Lifestyle Quarterly}, No.17 Volume XIX, 2007, p53). The vast majority of inveterate smokers will not learn the art of snusing. Murray Kessler, former Chief Executive Officer of UST, Inc - the world's leading producer of moist smokeless tobacco products - tells us that 9 out of 10 smokers that try smokeless reject the product. Smokers faced with the increased in the federal tax on cigarettes (effective April 1, 2009) have been telling clerks at c-stores they're thinking of quitting but hardly anyone has indicated they are thinking of switching to smokeless tobacco.

    We surely don't want our children - our future leaders to end up being nicotine addicts never able to achieve their full potential. Take a look at the first of R.J. Reynolds new dissolvable smokeless tobacco products called Camel Orbs (candy-like product) next to a container of Tic-Tac candies - quite similar.

    Here's a statement from Dr. Brad Rodu’s web site TobaccoHarmReduction.org: “Of course, you can also try pharmaceutical nicotine products but unfortunately the available nicotine patches and gums are not designed to be good long-term alternatives to tobacco.” It seems to indicate they want the users to continue with their addiction possibly forever.

    One of many related news briefs (do a random search of the archive): NO - don't even consider legalizing SNUS in Australia..

    References: Experts in Government, Public Health, Public Policy and Science Outline Blueprint for Reducing Death and Disease From Tobacco in the United States, redOrbit, 2/24/2009; A World Without Cigarettes
    Group acknowledges smokeless products are option for reducing health risks, CSP Daily News, 2/27/2009.
  • deebocools
    Member
    • Nov 2008
    • 661

    #2
    "Officer of UST, Inc - the world's leading producer of moist smokeless tobacco products - tells us that 9 out of 10 smokers that try smokeless reject the product"

    For arguments sake, if this is true, 1 out of 10 smokers accepts it, and reduces their risk. They are acting as if that is not worthwhile.

    Comment

    • SeneNatten
      Member
      • Dec 2008
      • 34

      #3
      There is no evidence smokeless tobacco can help people quit smoking. There are no studies we would consider sufficient.
      Saying that there are no sufficient studies implies that there are studies which show smokeless tobacco can help people quit smoking--just that those studies are considered insufficient. Otherwise he'd say something like, "no study has ever shown that smokeless tobacco can help people quit smoking." Insufficient evidence is still evidence, and perhaps grounds for conducting a study that would provide sufficient evidence, one way or the other.

      Ugh. This is one problem with democracy: policies are set based on popular opinion rather than educated opinion.

      Comment

      • Sal1000us
        Member
        • Jan 2009
        • 384

        #4
        We can take a couple of polls on snuson and give those guys some real numbers. I consider myself someone who has quit smoking. I smoked my last cig. on Dec. 15th of last year and have been snusing since then and no plans of going back to the cigs, ever. I am certain there are many members on this forum that have done the same.

        Comment

        • Old Frothingslosh
          Member
          • Jan 2009
          • 175

          #5
          I'm with you, Sal. 69 days smokefree. Couldn't have gone 69 minutes without snus!

          Comment

          • ShaulWolf
            Member
            • Jan 2009
            • 495

            #6
            Ah, the magic number.... XD

            Anyway... I used to smoke a cigar every night at my peak. Then every other night because of money, but still wanted that one a night. Then enter Copenhagen, and smoking went down considerably, but still once or twice a week.

            Enter snus. I have no urge to smoke since I started in November of 2008, but do so on rare occasion for the hell of it. For example, the Corps wide smoke and joke prior to Thanksgiving furlough, just prior to Christmas Furlough... and that's it.

            Comment

            • mercvrivs
              Member
              • Sep 2008
              • 484

              #7
              Smoke-free since September 2008. Snus was the only method that worked for me, and I tried everything.

              That marketing to kids concept is taken too far. What about wine? It is sold with pictures of grapes on it, just like Welch's grape juice. Pills all look like candy.

              Tobacco companies aren't marketing to kids by making tasty products; they're marketing to human tastes. The best thing that can be done is to enforce age verification, tax reasonably (key word: reasonably), and for the government to let people live their lives. I'm an adult and a citizen, I have the right to use tobacco, all the moreso since I choose a safer form -- Swedish snus.

              Furthermore, isn't the fast food/poor nutrition epidemic (which contributes to heart disease tremendously) something they should look at if they are concerned about public health and saving taxpayer's money? Why not tax McDonald's meals or fried chicken?

              Just like the prohibition against alcohol failed, so too will any proposed prohibition on tobacco. It is a tradition as old as human civilization, and it will continue in some form or another; I just hope that snus is allowed to continue and even prosper since it is a safer and healthier form.

              Comment

              • deebocools
                Member
                • Nov 2008
                • 661

                #8
                by saying "why not tax fast food" you are making a slippery slope argument, and although I agree that that would be ridiculous, it's been talked about! so don't tempt them further.

                part of the movie "super size me"(that no one made much out of) was at the end, his conclusion was that maybe mcdonalds ought to help pay for the health problems it "caused". If it were made legally obligated to do that, you can bet they wouldn't take it out of everyones taxes, they would levy a tax on unhealthy food.

                Comment

                • ladysnus
                  Member
                  • Mar 2009
                  • 601

                  #9
                  I have been on Paxil (ssri) for 20 yrs. I want to get off of it but every time I do, my life turns into a horrible mess. I get zaps, headaches, nauseous, anxiety, depression to the point that I want to die. There are millions of people that have the same problem with this drug. Did anyone warn me, did it come with a risk label, NO.

                  The WORST thing, they are giving this drug to children and it WILL mess with their lives FOREVER!

                  A month ago I had zero intentions of quitting smoking ZERO.

                  Enter swedish snus....I HAVE QUIT SMOKING. Sure, I have the desire every once in a while to smoke but I don't. I was a smoker for 22 years. I can easily distract myself from that desire by popping a strong snus.

                  Can I get off Paxil successfully- NO

                  Can I quit smoking on my own-H*LL NO

                  Can I quit with snus- Most defiantly- I have

                  They don't see proof? We are the proof

                  Comment

                  • DarrylR
                    Member
                    • Jan 2009
                    • 29

                    #10
                    Swedish cigarette sales:



                    Swedish snus sales:



                    On a longer term scale:

                    Comment

                    • desirexe
                      Member
                      • Feb 2008
                      • 1170

                      #11
                      Ladysnus - been there and done that with the Paxil. That drug is the devil! My doc prescribed it to me because I was having trouble sleeping, I would stay wide awake in bed and just think about nothing. How about telling me to go out and try herbal tea, warm milk, no tv, etc...I can't believe how quick doctors are to put a person on pills, including this Chantix crap I've been hearing about. For me when I quit smoking, it was either take a more 'natural' approach (snus) or a 'non-natural' way (Chantix). I'm here, I obviously chose snus! Who knows what Chantix will do to people in the future. I also remember my doc telling me that Paxil was safe to take during pregnancy, now I'm hearing about lawsuits stating that the drug caused birth defects! Glad I thought for myself and kicked that shit to the curb!! Haven't looked back and I now sleep like a rock and my kid is healthy and happy!

                      Comment

                      • PassedPawn
                        Member
                        • Dec 2008
                        • 319

                        #12
                        Originally posted by ladysnus
                        They don't see proof? We are the proof
                        They don't want to see the proof as long as they can use fearmongering to justify outrageous tax policies on tobacco. That's what it's all about, not health.

                        Comment

                        • glorfunk
                          New Member
                          • Feb 2009
                          • 10

                          #13
                          Smoke free since January. i started for two weeks with camel snus and it's not even a "good" snus. Haven't missed cigarettes a single day.

                          Comment

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