Dipper's Guide to Snus

[Snusdog]

Anyone find that snus has totally turned them off to dip? I was snuffing and dipping over the summer, and put in an order for snus around June, just to give it a try. Now, I still like the taste, but something just feels wrong with it in my mouth. I picked up a can of Cope snuff a couple weeks ago, and every time I decide to have some, I spit it out within 10-20 minutes because it just doesn't feel right.

Bingo! That's it exactly :!: :!: :!:

I posted an article a few weeks back about going under deep cover. In it I told how after about two years of exclusive snus I went back and bought a can of my old regular dip brand just to see if my initial comparison between dip and snus still held up.

Not only did it hold up, it was confirmed more than ever. My experience was just like yours. I could not keep the dip in my mouth for any period of time. Also, I could feel almost at once, the something other that American Tobacco puts into dip.

So I’m with you man.

And for me this means that I have absolutely no desire to ever EVER go back to dip. The quality, purity, and all around superiority of snus has exposed dip. That is why I am so thankful for snus and so passionate about it.

Thanks for your post shikitohno. I could not have put it better.

[bakerbarber]

Here's what I know for sure. grizzly cans are the best made cans. They seal and lock.

I put my loose snus in them, especially swedish match brands that have fiberboard. They last forever in a grizzly can.


Grizzly was $1.39 at the beer distributors. I bought a few and will try to figure out how to code them for various varieties of snus when they're empty.

[Snusdog]

yea I'm not a big fan of the fiberboard cans and some of the plastic ones are almost as bad.

[shikitohno]

Glad to know it's not just me. I think part of it is how dry my mouth gets with the stuff, which can be fixed by drinking while dipping. I liked the finer cuts, and while I could drink and keep a wad of Skoal mint together, I can't keep a chunk of Cope snuff in one piece if I drink. Aside from that, something just feels off. I get an okay nic hit from it, but there's this nagging voice in the back of my head, saying "Screw it! Get this out of your mouth and put some snus in there!"

[tom502]

Well, in my ongoing experiment to see how American dip pouches used like snus goes, I used a couple of coupons and picked up a couple of cans at the grocery today. Skoal Bandits Wintergreen and Grizzly Straight. First thing about the Bandits, they are rather expensive. It was $4 something. Is this normal price? Grizzly is rather cheap at over $2. Now the Bandit pouch size, is not like a mini snus, it is really just about the same size as a regular(large) snus portion, just a hair thinner. The pouch size is great. The Grizzly Pouches are bigger. I really didn't like the taste of Copenhagen Pouches, so I hope the Grizz straight is better. I'm going to eat now, but afterwards, I'll "snus" a Bandit.

Update!
Well, one thing I notice right off, is the dip pouch material is not as good as the snus material.
I did a Bandit wintergreen, and while not bad, it was rather weak tasting. I thought it'd be strong and sweet, and it wasn't. Pouch size was about just right. It's "doable", but not a solid pass. Kept it in about an hour and got tired of it. General Wintergreen is was more flavorful, more sweet actually, and the portion is more comfortable.

Now I just upper lipped a Grizzly Straight. So far, my thoughts are, this isn't bad. I like this more than the Bandit WG. I really did not like the taste of Copenhagen, but this tastes pretty good. Bigger pouch, but fits OK, and it soft. This is a not bad.

My idea to do this is, what if, for whatever reason, imported snus was just no longer available. I could just quit it all, I suppose, but I wondered if any of the US dip pouches could be used in the snus manner, and how would it be. So far, and I am not counting Grizzly Mint pouches, which I tried a while back, because I was not even used to snus then, I have tried Copenhagen Pouches, which to me, just tasted bad. Bandits WG, not terrible, but weak, and this Grizz Straight, which is not bad at all. I actually like this. I'll try Grizz WG next.

FOLLOWUP: The final answer I am thinking now, is no. It's just nowhere near as good as snus, and I think if I only had that choice, I'd just quit.

[Snusdog]

FOLLOWUP: The final answer I am thinking now, is no. It's just nowhere near as good as snus, and I think if I only had that choice, I'd just quit.

Agreed Tom!! And what's more, run this little test for a month or so of exclusive dip use and when your lip is torn up and you are popping Tumbs like a fiend b/c of all the crap you have been swallowing, I guarantee you your answer will be no.

It's just not worth it

[MojoQuestor]

... what if, for whatever reason, imported snus was just no longer available.

I'd be picking out my apartment in Sweden.

Okay, I'm a dreamer.

[Snusdog]

From another thread

As I think about the differences in the way that snus and dip behave in the mouth, I am becoming more and more convinced that it has a lot to do with the moisture factor rather than the cut.

Dip seems to start much dryer and then have some sort of preservative added to it (thus the longer shelf life and the lack of required refrigeration). Snus on the other hand is moistened the old fashion way (with water). The result is that snus does not bond or clump as well in the mouth (it runs more).

Now this could be because the preservative used in dip serves as a bonding agent (in much the same way that oil causes the vinegar to adhere to the leaf in a salad) or it could be because the snus does not absorb as much water (being already pretty moist) and thus it is more prone to over saturation and “mudslides”.

Regardless, my hunch is that what ever the factors are they are related to the means used to moisturize and preserve the product.

.

[Monkey]

Guys to each his own but as an x-dipper I strongly recommend staying as far away from American dip as possible. It’s just not worth the risk especially when there is snus. Just put the can down and walk away!!! :x

This is definately the best statement for me in this thread. My new mantra.

I quit cigarettes with dip and that seemed easier than the dip to snus.

Also the purity statements. That is definately something to remind myself of when I crave a dip.

Thank you for this thread.

Mike

[Snusdog]

Mike it takes a little adjusting and trial and error but you will find your groove. And man once you do, its so worth it.

Keep us posted on how it is going

[Mullolley]

How to get a Pris in your mouth without breakup

The quoted section below is a post from another thread that I thought might be of help. It describes how to get a pris into your mouth without it breaking up. It is a simple one hand (actually just two fingers) one motion method that keeps the pris from being squeezed (and thus breaking up) as you try to get it in. After the quoted section, I try to add some clarification.

I've got a question. The first time I handbaked, it came out really well and stayed solid until I was done with it. I'm getting worse and worse, though. I'll pack it up nice, but when I put it in it'll catch on my lip or something and break in half or worse, crumble. It's Ettan and it's pretty fresh, it hasn't dried out or anything. How do I stick it in?!?!?! (haha, I know)

I just lead in with the back of outside finger that is holding the pris- using the back of the finger to push the lip out of the way as I go. Also, I begin with my finger on the back of the mouth- where top and bottom lips meet when the mouth is open (not right where I am putting the pris). This makes it easier to catch the lip and slide the pris up into place while keeping the lip out of the way.

I have no idea if this makes any sense but I hope it will help.

Let me try this again:

1. Hold the pris between two fingers
2. Open your mouth and hold the pris above your tongue
3. Now move your fingers with the pris to the left or to the right
4. Your outside finger will hit the side of your lip/mouth
5. push/stretch the lip out a bit with the back of the finger
6. slide your finger up, around the inside of the lip until it is where you want the pris to go
7. put pris in place, remove fingers, and adjust with tongue to preference

Important: a big advantage of this method is that there is no need to grip the pris tightly and thus break it up as you struggle to get it in. Therefore, it is important to remember to relax, hold the pris lightly, and let the back of your finger clear the way in a single natural motion


.

This totally makes sense to me. I've been having a much easier time using this technique. Thanks!

[Snusdog]

From another Thread

so i read the sticky, but it didnt really answer my specific questions. here is the thing: when you pack a lip, there is a lot of saliva floating around, so you actually know you're getting the nicotine.

i just bought a generals loose and made a pretty good pris (i think anyway, it was pretty durable and no cracks, etc, looked a lot like the one in the video by zero) and i put it in. now i have a question, do i get it wet? because if i do, it runs, and if i dont, i dont get any flavor from it, and probably no nicotine, so im really confused.

i tried getting the first few ones wet but they got REALLY runny, but with this one, i literally put it in, and completely ignored it afterwards, i did *nothing* to it so far (its been like 10 mins). i feel like its still really dry (well, compared to dip it is, but its probably about as wet as it was when it was in the tin), and that no saliva is getting to it.

also i have gotten no flavor from it, nothing at all. so my question is, how do you handle it once its inside? do you just let it sit, or do you help it out with moisture, or what? also i put it somewhat off center, the middle of the pris (its about 1.2 cm long, with a diameter of maybe .4-.6 cm, so its kinda small, about the size of a bean).

so now its in, what do i do with it? also, is it safe to just eat it after im done with it? cuz its really a hassle to spit it out, i'd rather just swallow it.

BW,

Welcome to the forum mate. Glad to have you with us.

I second everything the others have said thus far. I also can relate to everything you have described. Moving from dip to snus requires a bit of adjustment. The payoff thought is well worth it. Give it time and be patient. Thus far your reference point for what tobacco is supposed to be like is dip. That will change over the next few weeks. In the meantime let me throw my 2 cents worth into the mix.

First, I remember putting my first few prises of snus in. It felt like I had a rock under my lip and except for a few stray pieces of snus, it tasted pretty much the same.

My advice is this:
1. Keep baking the pris as tight as you can (you can adjust your technique later for now tight is good). Try putting it a little further back in the mouth (not too much or you will have it slide on you- experiment around a bit). Now this is the important part. Leave it alone until it sets up. Just let it sit there like a big ol rock (or bean). Don’t worry about flavor at this point or the nic. You are getting one and the other will come.

2. Now by “let it set up” I mean the pris will begin to mold to your gum line. It will no longer feel like a block. This will take anywhere from 15-25 minutes depending on how well you can control your urge to fiddle (including pushing or pressing or adjusting your cheek from the outside of the mouth). Once it has settled, you can start touching it with your tongue. At this point you will begin to notice a little flavor.

3. Now let me stop here and kind of regroup. It’s important to realize that I am not trying to help you to taste the snus. That will happen more and more each day. What I am doing is trying to get your gum used to having snus in it. Once that happens everything else becomes much easier (and by that time you will taste more and more). Until then the pris will seem dry, awkward, and plastic. Your gum will also most likely try to push the impostor out (like your eye blinks when you get something in it). Put it in and let it alone. You will not start snusing for 15-25 minutes. You will however be getting nic.

4. Given your size restrictions for a pris you might want to try a little stronger snus (Skruf would be a great middle of the road option for you and is an excellent starter snus because it is easy to handel)

5. Now keep the pris in until it is done (I don’t always leave mine in that long but it will be good for you to know the range or life potential of snus). The pris is done when it starts getting bitter (or more bitter) kind of like reusing a tea bag one too many times- it just tastes flat and a bit like paper. Depending on the snus and how firm you are baking it one to one and a half hours is not uncommon (remember you just getting started 30 minutes in). Put it in, leave it alone and forget it. Then see how long it lasts.


Let me throw two more thought out there for you to consider. First, remember, you cannot gauge what snus is supposed to do based on dip. That’s like expecting wine to behave like beer because they both have alcohol in them. They are two different beverages and snus and dip are two different tobacco products. Clear your mind of what you think should be and just let the snus drive for a while.

Second, once your lip has acclimated (maybe a month maybe more) this all gets a whole lot easier and less regimented. It is then that you can and will begin to deviate and augment what and how you are do snus. Until then, let me suggest that you hillbilly some (lower lip it like dip) once every two or three prises. This will let you taste the snus more directly (so you know what you are looking for and what to expect when you upper lip it- and that is very important especially early on). It will also, give you a nic release and a feel more like what you are accustomed to with dip. But note you will lose more when you spit.

Man I hope this helps. If not just give me a shout and I will try to clarify.

Also, please keep us posted on your progress. You will not believe how much sharing your experiences here will help others. In fact I am going to copy this post over to the Guide because I am sure that other have and will experience the same things you are going through.

Excellent post mate

May the snus abide. 8)

[Snusdog]

From another thread- regarding Los flavor

earlier today I was noticing that the pris I had really started kicking in at about the same time period when I'd be halfway through a portion. I am thinking a key with lös is patience.

This is a great point and should be remembered by those just starting with los. Los takes a little time to fully develop. As MQ put it the key is patience

[Snusdog]

From another thread- Dip vs. Snus:

For me the issue between dip and snus has never been a one to one comparison between the nicotine levels. I get nic from both products but I also get something else from dip along with the nic that I do not find in snus. Let me illustrate what I mean.

A few weeks ago my brother in law tried to kill me with several Jagermeister-Redbull shots. After a couple of shots, I could feel the effect of the all too familiar Jager. At the same time, I also could feel the very distinct effect of the Red Bull. One shot- two distinct effects.

It is the same with dip- one pinch, two distinct effects. However, I never noticed this distinction and always considered it one and the same fix until I went off of dip completely (as long as I used snus and dip together, the whatever extra was still in my system). When I made the break from dip and went to snus exclusively I noticed it missing from the fix and my gums actually craved it. Also, the withdrawals are very different between the two products. The feeling of being without snus for an extended period of time is different from what I felt when I had to go with out a dip longer than I wanted.

Now I do not have a lab and so I cannot say definitively why this is the case. However, I don’t think the answer (one way or another) is going to be found on the ingredient lists that we keep seeing. The reason is this: to the best of my knowledge, the ingredient lists that I have seen only deal with those ingredients added at the final phase of production. There are several steps prior to the mixing and flavoring stage that contribute to the final composition of the product. For example, fire curing a leaf will change its chemical composition in a way that air curing will not. Yet this important distinction will never show up on an ingredients list.

The result is that these lists along with a simple comparison of the nicotine levels will provide us with only a partial picture at best.

dog 8)

[bondzai]

Dip...

Well I love Longhorn Straight or Redman Straight. I started with Snus but went to Longhorn Straight. I never spit. I just don't seem to salivate or I swallow it I guess. I use relatively small dips normally.

I thought Redman had an off taste and loved Longhorn. Now I seem to be moving more towards Redman and also Grizzly Straight... That off taste is attractive to me now. Dip is very reasonable for me because I can get a can of Longhorn for 1.35 and it lasts me a whole week. A can of grizz costs about two bucks.

Just recently, I think because of a job change where I am around new people in an office, I have reverted back to snus. I have been using Camel and Triumph that I got in Atlanta, but I have in the past gotten sample packs of the swedish snus... I like sweeter snus myself. when I was using snus, I tended to like gotesborg rape and roda lacket.